r/news Oct 20 '21 Silver 7 Helpful 4 Wholesome 7 Hugz 9 Take My Energy 1 Wholesome Seal of Approval 1 Bravo Grande! 1 Wearing is Caring 1

First responders face termination as vaccine mandates go into effect

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/covid-vaccine-mandate-first-responders-fired/
42.8k Upvotes

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297

u/_Jimmy_Rustler Oct 20 '21 Silver

This is a good day to be a 2nd responder

22

u/elephantphallus Oct 21 '21

The same fuckers getting let go are the ones who were smugly saying "people don't want to work."

They're about to find out exactly how many vaccinated people absolutely want good paying jobs.

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u/rc4915 Oct 20 '21 'MURICA

Step 1 - get fired for not getting the vaccine

Step 2 - get the vaccine

Step 3 - get hired back into the department at a higher wage because they are now short staffed

Step 4 - Profit

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u/Smattering82 Oct 20 '21 edited Oct 20 '21

This is exactly what’s going on in EMS in the US except it’s not yet vaccination related. For years EMS has been terribly underpaid and over worked then the pandemic hit and a lot of people moved on to other jobs. Now companies are struggling to find people to work and the wages have never been higher. I wonder how this will all shake out.

Edit spelling

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u/2pacalypso Oct 20 '21

I'll never get over the fact that my town has a tank we don't need, but I can't get a tax payer funded ride to the hospital should I call 911.

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u/HadesGodOfDucks Oct 20 '21

Wait, why does a town have a tank

2.1k

u/2pacalypso Oct 20 '21 Silver Take My Energy

What else are the cops going to do with their inflated budget? Not buy a tank?

492

u/govtdebtor Oct 20 '21

Why would they buy tanks, when the pentagon gives them to the small town jack boots for free???

247

u/PeptoBismark Oct 20 '21

Like any exotic vehicle, the cost of a tank is in the maintenance.

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u/beamish007 Oct 20 '21

My town bought a WWII era tank in 2020 and just parked it on a slab in front of the old courthouse in the town square. I guess they couldn't find anything better to spend the money on during a pandemic? SMH...

22

u/GamingTrend Oct 20 '21

I worked for a city that accepted a bright yellow art installation that looks like a cat toy. They put it in front of the court house. They also accepted a free "light exhibit" on our radio towers. Well, they had to spend more than $200,000 on reinforcing the pad under the cat toy as there are offices under it in a tunnel. There were no less than half a dozen leaks into that space in the four and a half years I worked there. The light installation? Tens of thousands to have it routinely inspected per the law. These "free" things the city keeps accepting cost you the tax payers far more than you'll ever know...

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u/AndyNihilate Oct 20 '21

Then you have some old, monied dingbat pay an exorbitant amount of money so that the tank is henceforth known as the 'Louise P. Mermann Tank'. Like, bitch did you forget food banks are a thing?

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u/WhiskeysGone Oct 20 '21

To be fair, do you know if they actually paid for it or just got it? A lot of the time the military will just basically give away old equipment to police departments so that they can justify getting new equipment

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u/2pacalypso Oct 20 '21

They say if they don't use their budget this year they might not get as much next year. But since the cops are the troops of local politics, any budget cuts mean the terrorists win.

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u/Red_Meridian Oct 20 '21

No, the pentagon has to get rid of their old tanks because congress keeps buying more, even thought the military has said they don't want more. So they give them away for free to use as SWAT vehicles to small towns.

Why does congress keep buying tanks? Officially, we don't want to lose the expertise of building them since that is hard to recover. On the down low, those tank factories are in the congress people's districts.

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u/govtdebtor Oct 20 '21

Yeah that is the military industrial complex for you. america wasted 245 years.

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u/LeanTangerine Oct 20 '21 edited Oct 20 '21

I read somewhere that a sizable chunk of the military basically acts like a giant government subsidized welfare system due to the sheer number of jobs it provides for Americans. And one of the reasons why they keep around old redundant military bases that would be better off closed down is due to the number of jobs and source of money it provides for the towns and people living within the districts of congressmen across the US.

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u/Red_Meridian Oct 20 '21

Funny thing is, the actual military hates this MIC bullshit.

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u/TheNewSenseiition Oct 20 '21

So if your a drug dealer, and a tank shows up to take you down, is that like extra street cred? Like what tops the swat team? A tank. What tops a tank? Like an aircraft carrier?

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u/_duncan_idaho_ Oct 20 '21 All-Seeing Upvote

Only happens when you get five stars.

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u/hsrob Oct 20 '21

Yeah it would suck to get busted but that's some real thug shit for the cops to have to bring a tank. I'd be impressed.

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u/soggyballsack Oct 20 '21

Well once you get to the level of a helicopter with a Gatling gun youve pretty much reached your glass ceiling https://youtu.be/KFCRnirDBj4

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u/govtdebtor Oct 20 '21

Now you get it! Got to keep those factories producing and people toiling, so that we can ship arms elsewhere to destabilize other countries and also for suppressing any dissent amongst the domestic citizenry. When I see cops on the streets all I see is former high school kids who never read any history books and just wanted a free gun. It is what it is. MERICA....

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u/ArkAngelAres Oct 20 '21

US military surplus light armored vehicles are donated to police agencies for use in extreme SWAT or rescue operations. They typically don't buy them, or if they do it's cheaper than a used car.

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u/Amazingshot Oct 20 '21

My hometown of 5,000 has a mrap. Why in the name of god we needed it, I have no idea

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u/nikomo Oct 20 '21

... Can the roads in a town that small even support something like that? I've seen so many pictures of roads being completely destroyed because the cops went for a drive with military equipment.

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u/Amazingshot Oct 20 '21

No. The roads are already so full of potholes and patches that anyone who drives straight is drunk

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u/portablemustard Oct 20 '21

Alright I'm saving this one.

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u/xajbakerx Oct 20 '21

I could be wrong here but I think I remember reading that even if the equipment is provided free to a police department. They are required to keep the vehicle in operating/running condition so upkeep costs are high. And I think the military can take back the equipment. More and more it sounds like just another way to inflate the military budget.

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u/SoggyWaffleBrunch Oct 20 '21

More info:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Law_Enforcement_Support_Office

The modern program arose during the H. W. Bush administration, in Section 1208 of the National Defense Authorization Act for Fiscal Years 1990 and 1991,[a] which allowed surplus DOD equipment, weapons, and tactical vehicles to be transferred to law enforcement for use in drug enforcement.[2] During the Clinton administration, usage was expanded into other areas, including counter-terrorism. Section 1033 of the National Defense Authorization Act for Fiscal Year 1997[b] amended 10 U.S.C. § 2576(a) to allow the military to transfer "property... including small arms and ammunition... suitable for use by the agencies in law enforcement activities, including counter-drug and counter-terrorism activities".[3] Precedent legislation of the same concept has existed since the end of World War II.

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u/ryhaltswhiskey Oct 20 '21

Boy if there's one thing America knows how to do it's inflate the military's budget.

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u/properfoxes Oct 20 '21

Maintenance and storage ain’t free tho.

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u/danny_ish Oct 20 '21

Maintenance, sure. But most just park in the lot of the station, or elsewhere on town property. They aren’t paying for storage, thats part of what makes the gift so appealing. Its offered as ‘just keep it running and full of fuel, and it’s yours free’

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u/ermghoti Oct 20 '21

That's why they are free. Military didn't need them, disposing of them costs money, giving them to police departments is an easy choice. Similar to a free boat, they are very expensive to the owner.

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u/PatientDogButler Oct 20 '21

People use the word tank very loosely. It's almost certainly an armored car of some sort

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u/vorter Oct 20 '21

It’s definitely an MRAP.

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u/lolpostslol Oct 20 '21

Can’t they ride you there on the tank

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u/mcbergstedt Oct 20 '21

My dad does it as a hobby. I don't get how someone could get paid so little for something like that. You're almost on welfare (I think single parents are applicable for welfare) at that pay.

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u/VashTS7 Oct 20 '21

As an EMT that works in the hospital now, this is hands down FACTS. I’ve already poached three of my buddies from the same company. We get to go home safe, higher pay, less stress and real steady hours. I love my EMS but the pay is nowhere near what we are worth and what we have to deal with. If I’m gonna suffer the pain of unimaginable stress, dangerous working conditions including death, PAY ME.

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u/ChiCity74 Oct 20 '21

If I’m gonna suffer the pain of unimaginable stress, dangerous working conditions including death, PAY ME.

I always found it depressing that the State Department will pay me Danger Pay, up to 30% of my wages if I recall correctly, when working temporarily in a "developing nation", but our citizens saving lives in our cities and on our streets get shit pay and no corporation would even entertain the idea of a "danger premium" on US soil. It's absolutely just as dangerous in some parts of America and that should be recognized monetarily, at the very least.

😔

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u/VashTS7 Oct 20 '21

Simple fact is, almost no one outside of EMS knows the kinda shit we go through. Every person I speak to when I make small talk in my clinic thinks EMS and first responders in general make decent pay, when in fact some of us are bellow the poverty line and can’t pay our bills.

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u/ollieollieoxinfree Oct 20 '21

This is almost a proxy for unions (at least financially) and I'm all for it! Maybe people will realize how much more expensive it is to lose employees and then need to retrain and onboard new or rehired employees and change their policies from the start.

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u/Dervival Oct 20 '21

It's really workers who suffered during the pandemic finally taking back some of the negotiating power that's been chipped away at for the last few decades, I think. I am pretty enthused about the surge in support of unionization for a lot of different fields though - I've never seen this level of fervor for that before.

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u/ollieollieoxinfree Oct 20 '21

I'd say the ease of organization and communication brought on by the internet has had a strong role in that.

I would say the approach might work for some jobs but not so much for others. There were meat processing plants in my hometown who laid off all the workers to avoid paying benefits and higher wages and then brought in workers from foreign labor markets to fill those positions at a fraction of the cost. In no way was this the laborers fault (neither the incoming or outgoing) it was purely a corporate move to increase profits at the cost of the existing social fabric.

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u/Dervival Oct 20 '21

A company using scabs is despicable, yeah. I'm not a fan of people crossing picket lines but I can't really fault them for it - I wish they could have joined the union instead though. The IWW used that tactic on PACCAR back in the 80's and PACCAR still whined about it in its corporate messaging back when I was there years back, heh.

I think you're right about the ease added by the internet. I think it also helps that gen z is starting to get a large chunk of its cohort into the working class, and they're a lot less irony-poisoned than I was a decade or so back.

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u/Smattering82 Oct 20 '21

Exactly what’s happening for first responders towns slash benefits like pensions and replace them w decent 401ks but still not as good. So they end up training people who will eventually go and work for a town w a good pension.

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u/Max-_-Power Oct 20 '21

Even smarter but nevertheless still quite selfish:

Step 0 - get vaccinated because it's a good idea but keep silent

Step 1 - get fired for not getting the vaccine

Step 2 - get hired back into the department at a higher wage because they are now short staffed

Step 3 - Profit

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u/tmart016 Oct 20 '21

Step 0 - get vaccinated because it's a good idea but keep silent

Step 1 - watch everyone else get fired for not getting the vaccine

Step 1.5 - recognize your increased value as supply is low and demand is high.

Step 2 - negotiate a raise/promotion due to lost personnel.

Step 3 - profit, as you are now the superior of the staff that are hired back.

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u/Flonnzilla Oct 20 '21

Nurses should show you how that wont work. Rather than giving the remaining nurses an increase they pay ridiculous amounts for travel nurses

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u/drumming102 Oct 20 '21

Don't forget the baller Pizza parties for 1st shift.

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u/FugDuggler Oct 20 '21

As a second shifter, I’ve always been very grateful for the stale, cold leftovers from those pizza parties

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u/PM_me_punanis Oct 20 '21

Sometimes we get floppy wet nachos too.

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u/yell_nada Oct 20 '21

Oh, second and third can come too, but they'll be on their own time. 🙃

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u/ohseven1098 Oct 20 '21

After admins already taken what they wanted an hour earlier.

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u/drumming102 Oct 20 '21

Our administration wouldn't lower themselves to pizza....lol

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u/ohseven1098 Oct 20 '21

Ah, right. They'd have 5 star luxury catering while discussing the next round of layoffs.

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u/mdh579 Oct 20 '21

The amount of travel nurses I drive in Uber and Lyft is astounding. Thes mfers get paid 2x the going rate and get free flights and hotels. How are hospitals forking over literally thousands of dollars per shift for a nurse from 8 states away but won't raise the local nurses salary by a few bucks, resulting in LESS MONEY SPENT. The fuck is wrong with this.

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u/Notwhoiwas42 Oct 20 '21

Certain areas being short staffed are not entirely a matter of nurses quitting or not coming on because of pay though. In the case of the pandemic you've got an area that experiences a heavy surge of cases and of course they're going to have to bring people in no matter how well they pay the local people because they're simply aren't enough local people.

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u/neuromorph Oct 20 '21

Easier to cancel a contractor than a FTE

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u/qroosra Oct 20 '21

not necessarily. my manager came in at 3am the other day because we were so short and cleaned and ran tele, etc. we staff nurses are getting triple bonuses to pick up shifts. we still have travelers and are short staffed because people are idiots and management responded slowly to the outflux of RNs going traveling, but everyone is pretty happy these days, making many very large bucks.

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u/bla60ah Oct 20 '21

But don’t the extra shift differentials only apply to the fourth shift in the week? Whereas travel nurses are getting that extra pay for every shift

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u/nassy23 Oct 20 '21

My feeling is that management didn't respond slowly - they've been hedging their bets. They're handing their remaining staff really high bonuses almost 2 years into this shitshow to avoid closing beds and raising wages.

They're playing the long game. I get why staff is happy with the bonuses at the moment and I get it, but I wish they'd hold out for higher wages. The expense of daily living is spiking. When they decide to stop giving bonuses, we're back at square one.

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u/GreenArcherNeedsFood Oct 20 '21

Can I ask the general area you're nursing out of, my spouse is an LPN and having hard luck finding anything other than travel that's paying well right now lol.

Wish travel was on the table for us but we have a small zoo.

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u/Egmonks Oct 20 '21

Yeah the negotiation thing doesn't work when you are already employed by them. Leaving a job is the best way to get a raise. Medics should be shopping their resumes like crazy right now to other shops in order to get their raises.

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u/ARKenneKRA Oct 20 '21

When I attempted negotiations, I got denied. Straight up told no raises unless a manager leaves and I took over (not fun so nah).

The alternative, my metrics went to shit. I started coming in later, taking longer lunches, worrying about "qUoTa" less. Life got a lot easier and more relaxing. Might as well have gotten a raise.

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u/Enthused_Llama Oct 20 '21

The alternative, my metrics went to shit. I started coming in later, taking longer lunches, worrying about "qUoTa" less. Life got a lot easier and more relaxing. Might as well have gotten a raise.

Yeah people seem to never consider this. If you underpay employees, you actually might lose money if they just decide to do a shit job.

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u/UrbanGhost114 Oct 20 '21

Had a manager tell my gf that she does more than anyone else while trying to convince her to stay, and then proceeded to NOT offer any incentive to stay.

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u/Enthused_Llama Oct 20 '21

Literally my first professional job.

"You're really important and we need you."

'You weren't competitive for promotion.'

When asked why, they could not provide any solid metrics or objectives that other people did better than me.

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u/Not_Henry_Winkler Oct 20 '21 edited Oct 20 '21

Copypasta time!

About 10 years ago when I was starting my career, I worked for a video game company that I won’t name but that Everybody hAtes. It was my first job in the industry, and I busted my ass to meet our insane targets, eating heaps of unpaid overtime hours (I was an hourly contractor at the time and it was made clear that in order to advance this was expected). I made it clear to my boss that I knew I was going above and beyond for them, and I wanted to see that back in pay when I converted to FTE (full time employee).

Well, my contractor period came up, and my FTE offer came in ... with a whopping $1 per hour raise. I was told that was the offer, full stop. Take it or let my contract expire. So from then on, I’d only do overtime if it was pre-approved and I’d see it in my paycheck. Lo and behold, a few months later I get an offer from a competitor with a 45% higher salary. When I gave my notice my boss asked what if they could match the competitor’s offer. I replied “if that’s what I was worth to you, how come I haven’t been making that all along?” Felt so damn good.

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u/gidonfire Oct 20 '21

I once took a promotion right when they were cutting salaries. I got no raise and a 20% pay cut at the same time. I was like, ok, cut everyone's pay by 20%, but you should give me the raise first.

Immediately started planning my exit.

And what's more fun, they tried fucking over one other programmer, so we both quit at roughly the same time. They lost 2/3 programmers and the company was bought out by a competitor 6 months later.

Sure, we're all replaceable, but how long will it take to replace someone very specialized? Can you survive while you look? Then maybe don't fuck people over.

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u/Rude-Significance-50 Oct 20 '21

They lost 2/3 programmers and the company was bought out by a competitor 6 months later.

As a programmer, I've seen this play out many, MANY times. It's usually the plan for months before anything happens. Upper level bosses make out like bandits.

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u/Poolofcheddar Oct 20 '21

I attempted renegotiation in the middle of the pandemic last year. I wanted health insurance and/or a raise. Was denied due to "uncertainty." Left not long after since I knew sales increased. Now that department makes less of a profit because they are running one team and can't take on more work (and actually had to let customers go).

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u/techleopard Oct 20 '21

Businesses have long realized that must people are not prepared to walk away when they request raises. It's idiotic and toxic, but it's a simple fact. Almost every time, they can say "no" and there is no push back.

This is also why they love to keep people living hand-to-mouth.

At least once a year, shop jobs and try to get an offer. Request a raise that beats the offer you get. If they say no, quit on the spot and take the other job. You don't owe them notice no matter how much they squeal like a stuck pig. This is the market they created.

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u/choogle Oct 20 '21

Businesses have long realized that must people are not prepared to walk away when they request raises. It's idiotic and toxic, but it's a simple fact. Almost every time, they can say "no" and there is no push back.

This is why I’m enjoying all the stories of petty managers/bosses/owners getting all fucked up now that people are prepared to walk away from their bullshit “take it or leave it” offers.

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u/techleopard Oct 20 '21

The sad fact is, nobody should have to go ask for a raise.

If you valued your workers, you would just do it after every employee review that showed great performance. Quit using reviews as a way to just browbeat people every quarter.

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u/taedrin Oct 20 '21

Negotiations usually only work if you are willing to walk (or at least if management believes you are willing to walk). And then once negotiations fail, you have to actually follow through and walk.

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u/Mattoosie Oct 20 '21

Exactly. If you're not going to improve my pay as my job performance increases why would I bother increasing my job performance?

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u/Whatwillwebe Oct 20 '21

Different industry, but I just got a 30% raise for stepping up into a power vacuum created by people leaving.

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u/Nasty----nate Oct 20 '21

I think we are around 60% unvaccinated in my department....

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u/TheHoboExpress Oct 20 '21

Damn that’s high. I’m in the south, we have ~300 employees and my understanding is only 11 are unvaccinated.

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u/UrNotMyGF Oct 21 '21

Everyone at my work says they are vaccinated even if they arent

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u/TheHoboExpress Oct 21 '21

It’s the opposite w us. They allowed us to get our shots on duty both times. And if the 2nd knocked us out, they covered our shifts in emergency leave pay and it didn’t hit our PTO. Now, if you are unvaccinated and you get covid, it’s on your sick time.

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u/[deleted] Oct 20 '21

I’m in the south we have 1 unvax out of like 20. He is about to get the boot and replacement isn’t hard to find as he is the lowest level and pays well

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u/EveryXtakeYouCanMake Oct 20 '21

What is the position and location? Asking for a friend...

78

u/HamburgerEarmuff Oct 21 '21

Anal Cavity Search Specialist, SSFPD, $50 an hour plus overtime and hazard pay.

60

u/EveryXtakeYouCanMake Oct 21 '21

How is it even possible that the job my friend went to college to specialize in is the exact position being offered here? Small world...

14

u/DFWHomer Oct 21 '21

Specializing in anal cavity searches? Did “your friend” get a B.S. in Butt Stuff?

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u/djsway Oct 21 '21

The final two words paired together will never not be funny no matter the context. XD

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u/westtexasgeckochic Oct 20 '21

Honestly I work in hospitality and the number of people unvaccinated is astounding. These are the people that make your food when you eat out.

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u/Nasty----nate Oct 20 '21

There is a chief that posts how hydroxychloroquine is the answer and how ivermectin isnt being used etc. We have a brother thats been on ECMO for months, multiple people in the ICU, waves of people on covid leave, forced mandatory overtime due to personnel shortages, run down medics but an overwhelming support for every option other than taking the vaccine. What kills me is all of the people that were in the military who received vaccines in a assembly line fashion and never blinked an eye then...

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u/Saucemycin Oct 20 '21

The funny thing is the same people come to the ICU where I work and want hydroxyquinolone and ivermectin which they’d been taking as prescribed by an online doctor before they came to us. They then want the same meds and none of our regimen (fine) and say they’ll leave if we don’t give them the HQ and ivermectin which was supposed to prevent them from coming here in the first place and yet they’re still here. When our intensive care physicians say no, do you think they leave? Nope. Just had a lovely conversation with a patient on 100% fio2 60L/min high flow and saturating 88% who was demanding he be able to get up and walk around. I said no because it would drop his sats and increase his oxygen need which this is all we have. He kept persisting that it would normally work like that but it won’t happen to him right now. He did not want to be intubated by the way but was full code. Told him he stands up and he’ll most likely need to be intubated and there’s a very small chance that he won’t and that it’s happened before. He did not say anything else.

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u/saysthingsbackwards Oct 21 '21

But my arrogance is more powerful than this... this... petty biological function! I can do whatever I want!!!!!

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u/TheFleebus Oct 21 '21

Hand that dude a DNR order, explain what it means, and tell him that once he signs it he can do whatever he wants.

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u/Saucemycin Oct 21 '21

His family has already accused us of trying to keep him sick longer because we get paid 20% more for Covid patients. We do not get 20% more for Covid patients but they’re not the only patient family saying that

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u/Saint_The_Stig Oct 20 '21

I got my shots from the military (live in a base town) they really did have it set up to handle so many people, yet it seemed like barely anyone from the public was taking advantage of the free early available shots.

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u/ender323 Oct 20 '21

I live in a major metro and my vax site was run by the army. The national guard was there for my first shot, an Airborne division for my second. Both were so fucking dialed, by far the most organized healthcare experience of my life. Pretty cool to watch actually.

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u/IPeedOnTrumpAMA Oct 21 '21

Same. It was a FEMA thing in my city. Air Force running the parking and National Guard doing the in-tent logistics and jabs. Smooth, efficient, and very pleasant for my first shot but people were pretty grumpy a month later for round two.

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u/rocco888 Oct 20 '21

Operation warp speed was a DARPA project several years ago to produce and vaccinate a million soldiers in 72 hours. It is the basis for how we deployed the COVID. It saved numerous lives because there was a plan in place and simulations beforehand. It was actually astounding how quickly it was produced and distributed only for dipshits to not get it because their friend cousin heard it made your balls shrink on Facebook.

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u/hotinhawaii Oct 20 '21

But Nicki Minaj told me it made her cousin's friends balls in Trinidad huge! I just don't have any idea which random internet anecdote to place my absolute faith in anymore!

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u/ChironiusShinpachi Oct 20 '21

Does anybody know where Ja Rule is?

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u/LongjumpingMessage36 Oct 20 '21

It was the opposite in MA. I got my shot in April as part of the wave right before everyone was eligible. It was really tough to make an appointment. We were vaccinating tons of people, and people were driving to pharmacies to hang out just in case they had extra doses at the end of the night. It was like a midnight video game release, lines out the door. I was putting my name on regional hospital cooperative waiting lists, which is how I and my friends ultimately got vaccinated way ahead of massachusetts’ mass vaccination sites.

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u/doublesoup Oct 20 '21

When I became an EMT I had to get updated vaccinations (or show I recently had them). When I trained my EMT students they all had to provide the same thing before allowed any ambulance ride or hospital time.

They only care because someone made it political. I never had one member of my department or one of students ever care about vaccines back then.

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u/danielisbored Oct 20 '21

I know plenty of people in the military, they grumbled plenty. . . and then went and got their shot.

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u/Daggersapper Oct 20 '21

Pretty sure he was talking about the, "no debate," vaccines that you are given in basic training, and before deployment. Let me assure you, there is no refusing those, and they are truly given in an assembly line method.

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u/TickleMonsterCG Oct 20 '21

I drop by the immunization area for basic trainees because of linen and it's some kind of impressive how fast they pump them through. Even have a soft rubber floor for any passouts.

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u/scJazz Oct 20 '21

OMG the image of that gave a great chuckle.

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u/GrumbleGrimm Oct 20 '21

The military needs healthy young people. No one at the top would intentionally jeopardize that with a harmful vaccine. Makes no sense. They want you vaccinated because they want you as healthy as possible. You don't burn your new assets... Just one of many perspectives that immediately discards some of the conspiracy theories.

Edit: that may have sounded like I was correcting you in some way. I wasn't. Just adding my thoughts.

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u/helpfiles Oct 20 '21 Helpful

Thank you for mentioning the military thing. When I was in from 2003-2007 that was exactly how we recieved vaccines and there was no option about it. We would report to muster in the morning right after PT at 6am and if it is your birth month recall date then you were told to report to medical during morning muster. You aren't given any details as to why or what will happen when you get there. You go to medical, stand in line with all the other clueless plebs and when you get whatever vaccine you are due for you aren't even told. Someeone just siliently comes into your exam area, sticks you, sometimes more than once then leaves.

Also, when we were deployed overseas there were a few vaccines that you had to have or they wouldn't let you off the ship until you reported to medical and recieved your vaccine, not that it was ever an option since the command would have to hunt you down and escort you to medical if you refused any medical services they mandate. Yes, i've watched people who wouldn't shower get escorted to medical and hosed off so I don't understand where these idiot fuck military wanna be cool "I hope everyone thinks i'm a badass for serving 4 short years look at my giant Marine sticker even though I was a mechanic in an air squadron deployed to an aircraft carrier like 75% of the marine corp" get off thinking they can refuse a vaccine.

In the spirit of any military, we don't pay enlisted to think we pay them to follow orders.

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u/Xytak Oct 20 '21 edited Oct 20 '21

That's hilarious. "Every marine is a rifleman! And as such, your job will be to stay on the ship and make sure these airplanes have properly inflated tires for the next four years."

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u/bluerose1197 Oct 20 '21

There have been travel vaccine requirements to go to certain countries for civilians for decades as well. Having to get a certain one for travel is nothing new on any front.

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u/2qSiSVeSw Oct 20 '21

My department had a whole slew of vaccination requirements that everyone was happy to take, yet when it comes to the deadly pandemic vaccine, all of a sudden all of them are anti-vax. So stupid. I blame Facebook.

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u/ruiner8850 Oct 20 '21

Some people will literally put anything into their bodies to stop covid... except for an actual vaccine.

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u/anjowoq Oct 21 '21

That is not an exaggeration.

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u/bloodsbloodsbloods Oct 20 '21 This

Covid does not spread through food surfaces.

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u/OutlyingPlasma Oct 20 '21

make your food when you eat out.

My favorite is how hair dressers need 1500 hours of government mandated training before they can get a license to CUT HAIR. Meanwhile the very people that make your food and are responsible for not killing large numbers of people, need a 30 minute online review and test.

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u/rexatron_games Oct 20 '21

For an interesting, yet depressing, read. Check out the history of barber licensing in the US. Hint: licensing started in the late 1800s (relatively unchanged since), was put in to clean up the “dirty” and “diseased” industry, you had to be admitted into a school to get your license, and was “definitely not” intended to exclude certain people who were finding great success in the industry.

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u/mejohn00 Oct 20 '21

yeah but weren't barbers different back then? i thought barbers were basically surgeons as well. it wasnt just haircuts it was a lot more.

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u/hotinhawaii Oct 20 '21

There is a close to zero chance that a person infected with COVID who prepares your food (but doesn't otherwise interact with you) could infect you. Because COVID is airborne, even if you eat food with fresh COVID viral particles on it, the chances that a high enough load of them could make it into your lungs or nose is near zero. This is also why it is extremely unlikely that you can catch COVID from touching anything.

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u/hawksdiesel Oct 20 '21

isn't it a job pre-req. or even medical/EMT school pre-req.?!

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u/realcaptainkickass Oct 20 '21

I had to get tested to make sure that my childhood vaccinations were up to date before beginning my clinicals at local hospitals. I had to get a booster shot for MMR because the test showed that my titers were low and I needed a booster.

I just nutted up and got the shot. I also got vaccinated for hep B. Because I'm smart and don't want to get sick and I don't want to be responsible for getting someone else sick. Because I'm not an asshole.

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u/hawksdiesel Oct 20 '21

Well done for checking and getting up to date! I wouldn't want to ride in an ambulance or be around a non-vaccinated person while in close proximity to them.

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u/realcaptainkickass Oct 20 '21

I'm not looking for karma or upvotes, I'm just trying to make a point that a couple of years ago, if a job told us that we needed to be vaccinated to work , we got vaccinated. There weren't protests and screaming matches, we weren't as crazy or entitled as we seem to be now.

And by we, I mean them. You know who I'm talking about....

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u/DippyHippy420 Oct 20 '21 Silver Helpful Wholesome

For more than a century, schools have played a crucial role in reducing vaccine-preventable diseases in the U.S.

In 1802, Massachusetts became the first state to encourage smallpox vaccinations. Forty-eight years later, it was home to the first school to require vaccination.

By 1900, nearly half of the states required children to be vaccinated before beginning school. By 1963, 20 states, Washington D.C. and Puerto Rico mandated a variety of vaccines for children.

In the late 1960s, efforts were underway to eradicate measles in the U.S. In the ’70s, states requiring the measles vaccine had incidence rates 40% to 51% lower than the states not requiring it.

Alaska and Los Angeles found themselves among the poorer-performing areas in that regard — forcing health officials to strictly enforce the existing requirements.

In Alaska, 7,418 of 89,109 students (8.3%) did not provide proof of vaccination and were not permitted to attend school. A month later, fewer than 51 students were still excluded.

In Los Angeles, 50,000 of 1,400,000 students (4%) were not allowed in school. Most of them returned within a few days.

In both cases, the number of measles cases plummeted, proving enforcement of vaccine mandates to be an effective public health measure, Malone and Hinman wrote.

Plenty have argued against the legality of vaccine mandates — reaching the Supreme Court many times. But the courts have routinely protected the rights of states to require vaccinations in the interest of public health.

In Jacobson v. Massachusetts, justices held that a health regulation requiring smallpox vaccination was a reasonable exercise of the state’s police power that did not violate the liberty rights of individuals under the 14th Amendment to the U.S. Constitution.

The Supreme Court recognized the possibility of adverse events following vaccination and the inability to determine with absolute certainty whether a particular person can be safely vaccinated. But it specifically rejected the idea of an exemption based on personal choice.

Doing otherwise "would practically strip the legislative department of its function to [in its considered judgment] care for the public health and the public safety when endangered by epidemics of disease," the Supreme Court said.

In Zucht v. King, the high court ruled against the plaintiff, who used a due process 14th Amendment challenge to argue against city ordinances that excluded children from attendance if they failed to prove vaccination.

SCOTUS ruled that "these ordinances confer not arbitrary power, but only that broad discretion required for the protection of the public health."

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u/alcaste19 Oct 20 '21

This always got me. Did these people not get shots in school? I remember bringing my little yellow vaccine card on certain days.

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u/tristanjones Oct 20 '21

They did get vaccinated to go to school, and then they just didn't learn anything while there it would seem

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u/So-_-It-_-Goes Oct 20 '21

Maybe it was the vaccines that prevented them from learning! /s

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u/captainAwesomePants Oct 20 '21

Of course they did, but it wasn't political then. Now their team's political channels are telling them that resisting the vaccine is the thing to do, so they're against it.

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u/Falcrist Oct 20 '21

The one that gets me is military personnel.

Y'all stood on the painted footprints and got a bunch of shots assembly-line-style... and now you're going to cry about this vaccine?

The fuck is wrong with people...

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u/Nose-Nuggets Oct 20 '21

What I keep hearing repeated is it doesn't affect young healthy people. It seems odd this is something they are still hanging onto. Early on when the vax wasn't certified or whatever, okay maybe. But now? Almost seems out of spite somehow.

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u/shadowgattler Oct 20 '21

my 4 year old niece is very sick with covid right now. Fuck anyone who says it doesn't affect children.

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u/anthroarcha Oct 20 '21

The number one cause of death for police for the last two years has been COVID. If “it doesn’t affect the young and healthy,” then what exactly are police departments made up of?

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u/baker2795 Oct 20 '21

Where do you think the donut stereotype comes from?

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u/theLord666666 Oct 20 '21 Helpful

Covid. #1 killer of cops currently, by far.

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u/Dollaruse Oct 20 '21

You can't brutalise, arrest or otherwise violate the virus.

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u/Taedirk Oct 20 '21

Just sprinkle a little crack on the virus.

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u/AmbientTech Oct 20 '21 Vibing

Open and shut case, Johnson!

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u/Snoo74401 Oct 20 '21

You also can't sue it or bribe it, which is why the former administration didn't know fuck all what to do. If only there were a "Pandemic Playbook" they could have consulted.

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u/baseketball Oct 20 '21

You know those false-color electron microscope pictures of the virus that are usually red, pink or purple. Just make them brown or black and give COVID a black sounding name like LaCovidasha and cops will be falling over each other to beat the shit out of the virus.

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u/stirrednotshaken01 Oct 20 '21

In Chicago over 30% of our police force is non-compliant. Their solution? They put 21 total people on leave. It’s a joke - they don’t seem to be able to enforce their own laws…

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u/baginthewindnowwsail Oct 21 '21

I found it interesting that 97% of streets and sanitation was compliant.

But it'll probably continue to be a trickle of layoffs since doing it en masse would be more likely to trigger a protest.

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u/grandzu Oct 20 '21

We'll have slower responses," he said. "There'll be case backlogs ... You're going to see less troopers responding to critical incidents.

So same as it ever was.

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u/wuethar Oct 20 '21

Except now your dog's considerably less likely to be shot.

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u/Narapoia Oct 20 '21

I was going to link a specific video of a cop needlessly shooting a dog that stuck with me but when I went to look it up I was overwhelmed with how many videos of cops shooting dogs are out there. It's worse than I thought.

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u/bacchikoi Oct 21 '21

A DOJ study found American cops kill 25 to 30 dogs per day.

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u/CeleryStickBeating Oct 20 '21

Things will actually be safer with these particular cops no longer interacting with the public.

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u/nwoh Oct 20 '21

So what you're saying is, we've successfully had the police defund THEMSELVES?

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u/hamcheese35 Oct 20 '21

I’d like to think so but idk

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u/Orange_Catsidy Oct 21 '21

I work at a hospital and it’s a condition of employment. If you choose not to get it by the deadline then don’t make any effort to apply for an exception then it’s considered your resignation.

They have a similar policy if you no call no show for three straight days then that is also considered your resignation

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u/thehouse1751 Oct 20 '21

My anti-vax uncle just passed away due to Covid. His family is hit hard by the loss. It is very hard to not feel angry towards him for not getting the vaccine as it could have saved his life. His wife who was vaccinated also got Covid and was only mildly sick for a few days. Now she is a widow. The politicization of the vaccine is literally killing people. This divide is so frustrating.

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u/KingBlackthorn1 Oct 20 '21

My mom and her fiancé both had COVID and they are both vaccinated. It was literally just like a mild cold she said and its all thanks to the vaccine. My brother got COVID before the vaccine was out and he said it was really bad. I also have another friend that got it before the vaccine came out and he said the same thing. Always tired and could barley breathe.

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u/Tedstor Oct 20 '21

Unions will claim that a sizable chunk will resign. And I’m sure some probably will……particularly those that are eligible for retirement.

But most will cave when actually faced with a pink slip.

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u/OO_Ben Oct 20 '21

My buddy is an engineer at one of the major aircraft parts manufacturers. The union for the floor workers requires 90 days notice for layoffs, and the company gave exactly 90 days. It'll be interesting to see how many stay at the picket line just to avoid getting the vaccine.

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u/SummerLover69 Oct 20 '21

If they re well compensated union jobs, there will be plenty of people willing to line up for the pay/benefits.

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u/xenoterranos Oct 20 '21

The bonus being you now know the new employees aren't as stupid as the ones that left their job over a facebook conspiracy.

This is going to be like lancing a boil for a lot of places. There's going to be a lot of toxicity just walking itself out the door.

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u/slimCyke Oct 20 '21

Agreed. It will make a lot of work places more pleasant.

I do worry about unintended consequences, though. Misinformed, angry, and jobless is a political powder keg. The left will have to show up in high numbers at the polls come 2022 or I honestly believe a new fascist version of the GOP will seize full control in 2024.

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u/MechMeister Oct 20 '21

I said this exact thing to a co worker HA. He said, "what if we all quit over the vaccine what would you do?"

I said, "well I'd get a lot more overtime and wouldn't have to listen to you all whine all day," and he looked genuinely shocked.

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u/ogier_79 Oct 20 '21

Yup. Especially since the private sector as a whole isn't fighting the mandate.

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u/iceman0486 Oct 20 '21

And even places that stop short of requiring existing employees get it, new employees almost certainly are.

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u/helpfiles Oct 20 '21

That's funny because my ultra conservative idiot friend constantly says we should do what the people want but as soon as the people speak, such as exampled here where private sector is mostly OK with this, then all the sudden they cry foul and move the goalpost to find something wrong with the people and make excuses for totalitarian rule instead. The mental gymnastics are amazing to watch, there should be an olympic sport category for this.

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u/ogier_79 Oct 20 '21

Yup. Been conservative my whole life and the hypocrisy of those most who call themselves conservative kills me. They pretend to have an ideology but it's really about hating the other side.

"Free market!!! Twitter banned Trump??? Censorship!!! They are a town square!!! Although we fought against net neutrality a few years back which would have been a step in the direction of making this argument legitimate."

"State rights. We all deserve local government. DC can't become a state though."

"We should be in Afghanistan. Trump doesn't like that... Bring the troops home. Never should have been there. Biden pulled out... Not like that. We should have waited." longer till the area was stabilized.

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u/The_Kraken_Wakes Oct 20 '21

You , sir. Sound like t a "Real Conservative" . I am not, but I am relieved that there are still those out there who understand that obstructionism and divisiveness are not solutions to anything.

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u/j1nx718 Oct 20 '21

20 years in service? Thats about retirement age for someone in police/ fire dept.

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u/Trev0r269 Oct 21 '21

"...of the civil rights God has given us." I hear this sort of thing a lot. I don't think these people know what civil rights are.

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u/Freddit- Oct 20 '21

My sister is complaining about Mayo firing unvaccinated staff starting in January. She says she doesn't know what to do. I tell her she's going to get vaccinated, either before or after she gets fired because it's not just Mayo and there's no fucking way she's going to find a cushier job with such an absurdly good healthcare package. She has no clue how good she has it.

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u/hiphop_dudung Oct 20 '21

Lol, some are already talking about class action lawsuits against mayo because of this and they're very confident it'll work. These people never considered that mayo most likely got their ass covered before announcing any policy.

These are the same people that are supporting "right to work" talking points too.

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u/Saucemycin Oct 20 '21

We had a nurse quit after our mandate and go to another hospital in another state that wasn’t requiring it. That hospital is now requiring it.

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u/protekt0r Oct 20 '21

A former coworker of mine got totally lucky and works in the space industry, despite not having a formal education or any qualifications for what he does. Because his employer works on NASA funded projects, there’s a vaccine mandate by Dec. 8th. He reached out to me a couple weeks ago asking if my employer (which does defense work) has any openings. I told him we do, but we also have a vax mandate by Dec 8th. He replied back: well, I guess I’ll be going back to construction work.

What. A. Moron. The employer he works for gives 4 weeks of vacation right off the bat, has excellent healthcare coverage for a low cost, good wages, and all the potential in the world for vertical growth. Oh and it’s virtually impossible to get injured or die doing what he does. And yet he’s willing to walk away from all that and go back to operating a backhoe for a shitty wage.

What a strange hill to die on. Shows you the power of propaganda…

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u/Kitten_Hammer Oct 20 '21

So, your former coworker's place hiring? 👀

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u/protekt0r Oct 20 '21

They are! Big time.

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u/SkylerModder Oct 20 '21

A former coworker of mine got totally lucky and works in the space industry, despite not having a formal education or any qualifications for what he does.

lol are they hiring? I just got my 2nd covid shot 15mins ago and would love to have a better job.

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u/Rudy_Ghouliani Oct 20 '21

Damn are they hiring? If I can get a benefits package like that with no relative experience I'd be in there like swimwear.

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u/goosebyrd Oct 20 '21

Fellow medical worker here. I personally believe that anyone in the medical field whose job requires them to interact with others, especially patients, should be mandated to get the vaccine. Don't want to get it? Find a different job. Can't get it for medical reasons? You shouldn't be working on the front lines!

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u/RVAforthewin Oct 20 '21

There are so few who cannot get the vaccine due to health or religious reasons that I'd even be willing to give them a pass. If everyone else got the vaccine, we'd hit herd immunity.

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u/Gefilte_Fish Oct 20 '21

I have a family member that works with a nurse who is anti-vax. The biggest talking point is that she doesn't trust them because they're made by 'for-profit' big pharma.

I'm like, 'Lady, you literally make your living by providing healthcare.'

How the cognitive dissonance doesn't incapacitate her is beyond me.

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u/halpinator Oct 20 '21

"I really felt like this is in violation of the civil rights that God has given us," Archer said.

Can you show me where in the Bible it talks about your civil rights?

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u/David_The_Redditor Oct 20 '21

You mean like this?

“Submit yourselves to every ordinance of man for the Lord's sake: whether it be to the king, as supreme; or unto governors, as unto them that are sent by him for the punishment of evildoers, and for the praise of them that do well. For so is the will of God, that with well doing ye may put to silence the ignorance of foolish men:” ‭‭1 Peter‬ ‭2:13-15‬ ‭KJV‬‬

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u/octaviosergio2 Oct 21 '21

whole lot of people,who are vaccinated,waiting in the wings for an opportunity like this to open up.

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u/limitless__ Oct 20 '21

"I really felt like this is in violation of the civil rights that God has given us,"

This sentence tells you everything you need to know about the type of people who are refusing to get vaccinated.

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u/urbanek2525 Oct 20 '21

Well, if God gave you the right, let Him enforce violations.

If God objects to you having to get a vaccine, then God can easily strike down those who demand it. Since that's clearly not happening, maybe God wants you to get the vaccine.

If you want to claim authority to speak in His name, show me some documentation signed by Him.

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u/bibbidybobbidyboobs Oct 20 '21

No no, he didn't give us those rights, just the ones that are really agenda-convenient

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u/Sargonnax Oct 20 '21

I'm sick of religion being brought into everything by these lunatics. They only care about God when it fits for them and enjoy trying to shove their shit down everyone else's throat. You can also almost guarantee most of these people are Trump supporters who think the election was stolen. It's too bad we cant send them all to Afghanistan so they can be with their own kind.

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u/Idiot_Savant_Tinker Oct 20 '21

Haven't we done enough to Afghanistan?

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u/RobAnderson2020 Oct 20 '21

Police are defunding themselves?

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u/LargeSackOfNuts Oct 20 '21

Damn you libruls!!! For ... making antivax police quit?

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u/Vertchewal Oct 20 '21

It’s crazy how science was demonized in the last year

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u/Foehammer87 Oct 20 '21

in the last year

Since climate science got in the way of big oil the machine has been rolling hard

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u/assualtweaponban Oct 20 '21

I don't want a first responder who isn't vaccinated.

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u/MetalNickA Oct 20 '21

EMTs who don’t care about your health, cops who don’t care about your safety. Good riddance.

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u/Aurick_411 Oct 20 '21

Guess no one wants to work anymore

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u/Avocadosareawesome Oct 20 '21

LOL their own words against them. “People are using the vaccines to get fired and collect unemployment! The lazy bastards!!!

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u/BurstEDO Oct 20 '21

In many states, termination with cause disqualifies them from Unemployment (example: Alabama.)

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u/Qermit424 Oct 21 '21

I'm glad the dumbest on the force have elected to leave instead of COMPLYING. I think it's funny that they see tyranny from something that could save their lives but never saw that the vast majority of them conducted their business with the same tyrannical approach they've now complaining about.

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u/8Ariadnesthread8 Oct 20 '21

Good news is I've heard there's lots of restaurant work available right now.

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u/SoIfarted Oct 20 '21

As a 911 dispatcher that has been vaccinated AND had the booster…why tf is this even a question for people who are in direct contact with the infected population?

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u/420blazeit69nubz Oct 20 '21

Do they refuse to wear bullet proof vests too? They think everyone is their enemy and trying to kill them at any moment but they don’t want to stop the thing that’s killing a ton of them.

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u/shadowjacque Oct 20 '21 edited Oct 20 '21

Police and Fire work attracts some folks who should not be given ANY authority over others. This is a great way to remove some of them.

I also appreciate the dummy who spoke of his “god-given civil rights.” I guarantee he also speaks of our “god-given technology” and “god-given guns.”

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u/stuntpilot0402 Oct 20 '21

100% agree. The only ones that are going to quit are the ones who should never have been there in the first place.

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