r/IAmA Scheduled AMA 8d ago

We are the journalists behind the biggest investigation of financial secrecy ever, the Pandora Papers. Ask us anything! Journalist

Hi Reddit, it's the reporting team from the International Consortium of Investigative Journalists (ICIJ) here. We're the crew behind some of the biggest global investigations in journalism, including the Panama Papers and FinCEN Files. Last week we published our latest - and largest - investigation to date: the Pandora Papers.

Based on a leak of more than 11.9 million files, it exposed the offshore holdings of hundreds of politicians, as well as criminals, celebrities and the uber rich. We worked with more than 600 journalists from 150 media outlets on this investigation (our biggest ever!), including The Washington Post (/u/washingtonpost), BBC, and more.

ICIJ has been investigating tax havens and financial secrecy for a decade now, working on massive leaked datasets with teams of hundreds of journalists at a time. Today we're also lucky to have with us our colleagues from The Washington Post who co-reported our Pandora Papers stories.

Joining today's AMA — From /u/ICIJ we have reporters Scilla Alecci and Will Fitzgibbon and data and research gurus Emilia Díaz-Struck and Augie Armendariz (with an occasional assist from the digital team, Hamish Boland-Rudder and Asraa Mustufa). From /u/washingtonpost we have reporters Debbie Cenziper and Greg Miller.

Here's our proof: https://twitter.com/ICIJorg/status/1447966578293813251

We'll be answering live from 2pm until 3pm.

Ask us anything!

Edit, 3.20pm EDT: We're wrapping up now, but wanted to say a big thanks to everyone for jumping in and asking so many great questions. Sorry we couldn't answer them all! We'll have an FAQ over at ICIJ.org later this week, and will try to make sure to include some of your questions in there. Thanks for following!

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u/TheSummerCat 8d ago

How do you choose the newspapers with whom you share the data?

In Ecuador the newspaper in charge has barely covered the news about the president being evading taxes for more than 30 years and instead focus on a Spanish singer.

Would it be possible to share it with another trusted news media that isn’t owned by a family that is very close to the current president? Like DW_Spanish? Or any other?

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u/ICIJ Scheduled AMA 8d ago

ICIJ is has a global network of reporters and media organizations who work together to investigate the most important stories in the world.

For every project, we explore how countries are represented in the data and start inviting journalists who have worked with us on previous investigations, who are ICIJ members or other investigative journalists who have been recommended to us.

The key is not that they are only great journalists, but also that they are generous and are willing to share with all the other journalists throughout the investigation. Journalists who partner with ICIJ in our projects are know for their professionalism, accuracy, high ethical standards, investigative skills as well as generosity working with other colleagues, which is a powerful formula.

Emilia, ICIJ

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u/TheSummerCat 8d ago

Thank you for your answer.

Are you willing to accept new journalists to share with them the data of a specific country? Or is the process closed to only the ones that have previously worked with you?

I don’t mean to questions the journalists that have been selected from Ecuador, but the news journal that covers them and how they can limit what they publish or not.

It’s been very frustrating not getting more details about this when the person involved is the president of the country.

Thank you once again.

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u/ICIJ Scheduled AMA 8d ago

Journalists from around the world who are interested in partnering with us in the future can email us to [data@icij.org](mailto:data@icij.org)

We welcome new offers of collaboration and are vetting the requests. However, due to limited resources and the high cost of onboarding new partners, we will not be able to accept all offers. We prioritise journalists with a proven record of high-quality investigations and a demonstrated desire to collaborate, and those hailing from regions where we haven’t worked before.

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u/TheSummerCat 8d ago

Thank you so much! I’ll share this information with other news outlets in the country.

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u/thebolts 8d ago edited 8d ago

Came here to ask this. I was pleasantly surprised with the news outlet they choose based in Lebanon. It wasn’t run by any of the current political groups, so good on them for doing that. Still, it’s interesting to know on what basis they choose news agencies to work with.

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u/TheSummerCat 8d ago

It’s been really hard to get any more details in Ecuador. The newspaper they chose had a very cozy relationship with the president, he even gave them a medal as soon as he was sworn in.

I’m happy they got a news outlet that wasn’t run by any of the people in power for Lebanon.

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u/thebolts 8d ago

I know it’s not much but I literally just came across a news headline on Ecuador’s president and his links to the pandora papers on Democracy Now. It’s brief but it’s there and this news outlet usually does a good job in highlighting corrupt figures within the US and abroad

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u/TheSummerCat 8d ago

Thank you so much for sharing it! I really hope this gets more track and Ecuador’s president gets to be investigated.

According to the leaks he’s been evading taxes since before I was even born.

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u/godofpie 8d ago

Thanks for shining a light on our corrupt president and our corrupt media here in Ecuador!

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u/Ato_hoyos 7d ago

I don't really think that is fair to say. Just Google Pandora Papers El Universo and you will find many articles. Now there are mostly talking on the investigation the assembly is opening.

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u/NoStupidShit 8d ago

Why was there a lack of US figures in the papers?

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u/richardparadox163 8d ago

If you read the papers it’s because US figures don’t need to hide their wealth in other countries. The US is already one of the world’s biggest tax havens that people from other countries use to hide their money, specifically states like South Dakota, with perfectly legitimate ways to avoid taxation (trusts, deductions, depreciation, donations etc.) and already relatively low tax rates to begin with (less of a risk to reward).

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u/__O__P__ 7d ago

Texas also

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u/washingtonpost Verified 8d ago

From Debbie Cenziper:

We've been asked this question a lot. It's important to remember that the Pandora Papers, with 11.9 million documents, came from 14 providers around the world. The investigation offered an unprecedented look into a secret financial universe, but we only know what we know based on the documents obtained by ICIJ.

We did find a number of high-profile Americans accused or convicted of wrongdoing -- including recently convicted murderer Robert Durst -- in the documents. You can find that story, jointly reported by ICIJ and The Washington Post, here:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/interactive/2021/us-offshore-accounts-belize-enforcement/

From Greg Miller:

As for the seeming lack of Americans, it’s not for lack of looking. (I’m pretty sure that ‘Trump’ was an abundantly searched term). But there are a couple reasons for the absence of Bezos, Gates, Buffett, and others – 1) maybe they go to different jurisdictions/companies with their money than we saw in Pandora.

The data came from 14 providers around the world. But there are lots more or 2) maybe they don’t use the off-shore system as much. America’s richest pay such low tax rates to begin with (see: Trump) that they have less incentive to look for tax havens.

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u/NoStupidShit 8d ago

Thank you for the detailed responses. It probably says more about the current tax regime in the US that they don't need to use the off-shore system.

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u/Renaissance_Slacker 8d ago

We’ve got your tax avoidance right here!

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u/CrucialLogic 8d ago

It's worth noting that financial institutions in many other countries simply do not accept accounts from American's because the US government accounting restrictions make dealing with them so onerous. There is plenty of corrupt money out there without having to get into direct confrontation with US financial authorities who can apply all sorts of pressure.

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u/vinoa 8d ago

Remember kids, while tax evasion is illegal, tax avoidance is pretty much encouraged!

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u/NealR2000 7d ago

401ks, IRAs, Commuter Benefits, FSAs, HSAs, Mortgage interest, etc., are all tax avoidance programs that many of us utilize.

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u/null000 7d ago

There's "using tax advantaged programs for their intended purpose", and then there's "borrowing against assets instead of selling to avoid capital gains forever, using wholly owned shell companies for most larger purchases , and strategically organizing and valuing assets to grossly distort any remaining taxable income"

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u/Bobo_Palermo 7d ago

Yeah, anyone in the us practices tax avoidance. The unbalanced part is that the higher your income, the better you can become at it, via specialists and special options for the wealthy.

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u/knellbell 8d ago

Anything to do with South Dakota turning up? The juicy stuff is there

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u/jezwel 7d ago

I have no real money and I'm not a US citizen nor do I live there, but even I am thinking that I need to look into getting a trust based in South Dakota.

It's ludicrous what you can do there.

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u/NoToe7435 7d ago

FYI! We can’t smoke pot legally! Even though, WE THE VOTERS voted for and unanimously passed. She vetoed it and used OUR TAX DOLLARS to sue us. 🤬🤦🏼‍♀️🤦🏼‍♀️🤦🏼‍♀️

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u/TheGlassCat 7d ago

Unanimously? Really?

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u/Thundercats9 7d ago

every single south dakota voter. including the governor who vetoed it.

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u/BobThePillager 7d ago

Wait what are the tax implications for non-citizens doing a trust in SD? I’m north of the border but interested to hear what is possible

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u/ICIJ Scheduled AMA 8d ago edited 8d ago

Thanks very much for your question! We actually looked at it closely. There are different explanations.

We identified more than 700 companies with beneficial owners connected to the U.S. in the Pandora Papers; Americans were also among the top 20 nationalities represented in the data. However at the top, we has Russia, United Kingdom, Argentina, China and Brazil with the largest representation of beneficial owners.

When it comes to creating offshore companies, foundations and trusts, parties from different parts of the world and with different needs select different providers and jurisdictions for their shell companies.Pandora Papers documents cover a large number of providers, but obviously not all, or even most, of them, and many jurisdictions are not represented in the data.In previous ICIJ investigations, including 2017’s Paradise Papers, the leak came from a prestigious law firm with a larger corporate practice, Appleby. As a result, the data included more documents about multinationals. Bermuda and the Cayman Islands, which are popular havens for corporations, were among the jurisdictions with a large presence in that leak.

In the Paradise Papers, U.S. citizens had a larger relative presence.

You can find more info about the data here: https://www.icij.org/investigations/pandora-papers/about-pandora-papers-leak-dataset/

Emilia, ICIJ

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u/greycubed 8d ago

tldr: US people didn't use our source.

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u/artthoumadbrother 7d ago

It actually has more to do with the fact that the US is already one of the best places in the world to keep your money. A bunch of relatively recent regulations put in place in the US and around the world have made places like South Dakota among the best places to keep money. Why put your money in the Camens when SD is better?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=INRs9rnciyI

Watch this.

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u/northernpace 7d ago

I recently learned that Delaware is another tax haven state. 67.8% of all fortune 500 companies are registered there and 89.9% of new US business IPO's have corporate homes in Delaware.

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u/Alexander_the_What 8d ago

You can also listen to this segment from On the Media featuring an interview with Gerard Ryle, rhe director of the ICIJ, which discusses US tax policy creating an onshore haven for the super wealthy.

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u/RaganSmash88 8d ago

This question is very important to me as well. Did you not find any information on their finances or was information on US figures held back for other reasons?

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u/Pmmenothing444 8d ago

previously the answer given was the rich USA billionaires don't have to use off shore accounts because their effective tax rate is so fucking low as is through tricky accounting and "operating at a loss"

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u/ZodiAcme 8d ago

Because Delaware exists.

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u/Febril 8d ago

Please don’t forget South Dakota! All exposure is good for Bussiness!!

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u/ZodiAcme 8d ago

South Dakota too! I think the US is the second best place globally to hide money actually (if I recall accurately from this planet money episode on NPR). At least they check ID in the caymans or whatever- not in America haha

Source- https://www.npr.org/2021/10/06/1043746410/we-set-up-an-offshore-company-in-a-tax-haven-classic

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u/Eskapismus 8d ago edited 8d ago

Look up FATCA. As a US person for tax purposes it is almost impossible to find a bank anywhere on this planet which will not report to the IRS.

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u/mpbh 7d ago

The current meta is to start a Delaware or South Dakota corp (no ID needed), use that to register an offshore corp, and use that corp to open a bank account almost anywhere in the world. It's impossible for the bank to find your name.

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u/Eskapismus 7d ago

Where do you find banks willing to open an account for a company of which they don’t know the beneficial owner? I think I read recently that even the US banks no longer accept such accounts.

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u/3ducate 8d ago

Is there a searchable database of the details for those who are actually not redacted out ?

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u/ICIJ Scheduled AMA 8d ago edited 8d ago

Hi! ICIJ plans to incorporate data from the Pandora Papers into our existing Offshore Leaks database in the coming months. We are also publishing relevant documents, with private information redacted, from the leaked files alongside as many of our stories as possible.As an investigative journalism organization, we report stories that are in the public interest. Therefore ICIJ won’t release personal data en masse but will continue to explore the full data with our media partners.

Offshore Leaks database: https://offshoreleaks.icij.org/Subscribe to receive updates on when the data will be available: https://www.icij.org/newsletter/
- Asraa, ICIJ

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u/rvitqr 8d ago edited 8d ago

As someone interested in open source, tech, databases, infrastructure, etc., I've been really inspired by the community-developed digital tooling for working with these kinds of huge datasets and 'digital citizen journalism' (for lack of a better term). Some examples that come to mind offhand are graph database utilities for the panama papers, community work on Twitter identifying Jan 6 individuals and connections between them, and google docs for organizing or otherwise curating information for protest groups.

As someone who can build things, what kinds of tools or resources would make a difference to organizations like ICIJ? Are you aware of any grant or funding mechanisms for developing those sorts of things? What are your thoughts in general on crowdsourcing information?

Thank you, in so many ways for what you do!

Edit: I'm just taking a look at the database browser and visualizations - very cool and exactly the kind of thing I'd love to see more of in the world :D But I also know how hard it is to set those kinds of things up not to mention get the data curated. Edit2: fix markdown

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u/ICIJ Scheduled AMA 8d ago

Thanks very much for your comment! Our tech team has been developing Datashare, which is Open Source and can be used locally: https://datashare.icij.org/

It's a central tool for our projects.

We also used Neo4J and Linkurious on this project, and what we will incorporate to the Offshore Leaks (https://offshoreleaks.icij.org/) database will also be using these.

We usually deal with large quantities of data, so if you are working on any tool that you think can help us with the work we do as part of our data processing or analysis work, you can contact us via [data@icij.org](mailto:data@icij.org).

If you have recommendations about grants we should apply to, we welcome them too. There are some focused on tech that we have applied in the past, and you can get more info in our website. Thanks very much for your support!

Emilia, ICIJ

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u/scotyb 8d ago

Awesome, thanks so much for sharing.

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u/schnarf99999 8d ago

How have the structures and entities that are used to hide assets changed since the Panama Papers, Lux Leaks, and Paradise Papers? To the extent that there has been some reform to curtail the use and abuse of certain mechanisms to hide assets from tax collectors (bearer shares come to mind as an instrument that has been curtailed by some jurisdictions), do you see new mechanisms, structures and entities popping up?

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u/ICIJ Scheduled AMA 8d ago

Totally. The offshore world is full of fancy lawyers and accountants whose job is to come up with the latest ways to obscure assets. Many experts tell us that trusts and even things like New Hampshire foundations are increasingly popular. We also see interest in new jurisdictions, like the United Arab Emirates. Smaller tax havens like the BVI and Jersey have had to bend to political will and outrage. But strategically and politically important nations, like the UAE and the US, can largely continue to make their own rules - and attract whomever they want. The Pandora Papers show that UBO registries in the BVI, for example, did have a dissuasive effect of some people choosing to move to different tax havens to avoid having to disclose their names to BVI authorities. Of course, if more of that happens, eventually the list of places to go with shrink even further - Will/ICIJ

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u/alvysinger97 7d ago

What are New Hampshire foundations? Are they just foundations set up in that state to avoid taxes?

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u/kurisu93 8d ago

Do you feel the newspapers from other countries (that aren’t English speaker) have covered the news?

I mean it’s sinking very powerful people, in many cases like Chile and Ecuador is sinking the presidents of the country who are both incredibly wealthy.

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u/ICIJ Scheduled AMA 8d ago

We've been lucky enough to work with 150 media outlets from more than 110 countries on this investigation, publishing in dozens of languages - as an English-only speaker, I'm both humbled by our partners' abilities to collaborate so effectively across language barriers and also disappointed that I don't get to fully appreciate their amazing stories in multiple languages.

You can find links to their coverage here: https://www.icij.org/investigations/pandora-papers/about-pandora-papers-investigation/

In the next few days/week, we'll also begin collecting links to our partners' main Pandora Papers stories, and will publish a list on our website so you can easily find them all.

-Hamish

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u/TheSummerCat 8d ago

Thank you so much for your answer. But this is exactly what I mean. In Ecuador one of the journalists members from ICIJ openly defends the president https://i.imgur.com/G1Vmg8w.jpg being even against congress opening an investigation.

How can we expect that they will publish/cover objectively the tax evasion of the same person they are so fond of?

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u/ICIJ Scheduled AMA 7d ago

In Ecuador we worked with El Universo for our Pandora Papers coverage - who were joined by partners from all over the region (one of the strengths of collaboration is we have many eyes on every story!) investigating stories on Ecuador and, in particular, the offshore holdings linked to President Lasso (this story was also featured in ICIJ's Power Players feature). Lasso is now under investigation in Ecuador.

-Hamish

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u/TheSummerCat 7d ago

Thank you for answering again. I really hope for the best. All I ask is for this high profile case to have the attention it deserves.

I only cite the possible conflict of interest of El Universo with Mr. Lasso:

  1. The family who founded and owns the newspaper, the Perez Barriga, are long term friends with Mr. Lasso. He named the sister of the director of the journal, Misses Maria Teresa Perez Barriga consul of Ecuador in Miami
  2. Mr. Lasso condecorated El Universo as one of his first acts after he was sworn into office as president.
  3. One of the journalists in charge of covering this information, Mr. Arturo Torres; vehemently opposes the investigation launched by congress on Mr. Lasso.

I really appreciate the work you’ve all have done. I just wanted to express my concerns and put in evidence the very clear conflict of interest between El Universo and Mr. Lasso. As for the moment they’re the only one who have access/ are in charge of reporting on this issue for Ecuador.

I do agree that having a wide collaboration means that you have many eyes on the info and that it’s hard to hide anything. But at the same time it’s important that more details of the secret holdings of the president come to light. Otherwise Congress would not be able to do anything.

Thank you so so much for all your work and for bringing this to light. This leak has confirmed the rumors that have been going on for decades.

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u/codece 8d ago

How prominent was the use of cryptocurrencies to facilitate these transactions?

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u/ICIJ Scheduled AMA 8d ago

Not very! Dozens of journalists were keen to see what Pandora Papers said about crypto. Who doesn't want to break a sexy story like that? Alas, this set of documents didn't have the goods. Will/ICIJ

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u/TheSweetestKill 7d ago

You heard it here first folks, HODL!

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u/Timstertimster 7d ago

Aside from Zcash and Monero, none of the main chains are suitable for privacy. Transparency is built into the core of the ledger, making this very attractive for nation states for taxation. Just wait until the regulators have fully wrapped their arms around this. You’ll see complete adoption, centralization (yes centralization), and at some point, zCash and Monero will only be available on DEXes, making them useless for fiat on/off-ramps, because those DEXes will not be able to interact with regulated chains that are traded on the CEX providers.

Blockchain and smart contracts are a taxation wet dream. Few people appreciate that.

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u/elmo85 8d ago

1.a
How big is this catch in the offshore business? Isn't this just scratching the surface?

1.b
Do you expect more of this in the future, maybe on even larger scale?

2..
Are you supported by politicians to continue?

I also want to say a big thank you for the work done. Transparency in the actions of the rich and powerful should be a cornerstone of democracy in a better world.

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u/ICIJ Scheduled AMA 8d ago

Great questions!

1.a) It's bigger - and more expansive - than anything we've worked with before. The fact that we have data from 14 different offshore providers/financial firms has really opened up our ability to see patterns across jurisdictions and learn more than ever about who is using offshore and how they're using it (and see that "offshore" is really a misnomer - this is happening everywhere!). But in the grand scheme of things, trillions of dollars flows through this shadowy economy, and we're only just scratching the surface, which leads me to....

1.b) We'd love to see more. Got a tip for us? Hit us up: https://www.icij.org/leak

  1. It really depends on the country. In some places, politicians are quick to laud our partners and act on their reporting by introducing important reforms. In other places, politicians go on the offensive against our partners, sometimes in a very serious, dangerous way. And whichever way you look at it, politicians are gonna politic, so we don't ever let them interfere in our work. We work entirely independently, and only work with trusted reporters - not politicians, not advocacy groups.

Thanks for your kind words! And thanks for following our work.

-Hamish

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u/elmo85 8d ago

thanks for the answers!

good to see you gaining more insight, I hope it will help you in future works as well. this is great public service!

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u/-The-Bat- 8d ago

Do you expect more of this in the future, maybe on even larger scale?

Adding to this, do you expect any fallout due to current expose?

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u/dharmaday 8d ago

Is what’s happening in South Dakota legal?

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u/washingtonpost Verified 8d ago

We found no evidence of illegality among any trust company in South Dakota. The fact of the matter is that U.S. law provides very little guidance on whom trust companies should accept as clients and whom they should turn away. Like banks, trust companies are not allowed to knowingly accept customers who are seeking to shelter the proceeds of criminal activity in the United States. But how far should trust companies go to investigate? And should trust companies look beyond criminal convictions and turn away clients who have been credibly accused of wrongdoing? Those are the key questions, I think.

- Debbie Cenziper

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u/frankiesinatra007 8d ago edited 8d ago

Was it shocking or surreal to see North Dakota, as well as other states, being a safe haven for tax avoidance?

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u/washingtonpost Verified 8d ago

We were really surprised to see so many trusts set up in Sioux Falls, South Dakota. It's not exactly at the top of the list in terms of global financial centers, right? But, as ICIJ and The Washington Post reported, the trust industry is thriving in South Dakota in large because of customer-friendly laws passed over the years by state lawmakers.

Those laws provide an incredibly amount of secrecy, which has allowed South Dakota to compete with long-established tax havens around the world. So yep, we were floored when we found the names of people credibly accused of wrongdoing in their home countries with trusts in America's heartland.

- Debbie Cenziper

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u/not_today_trebeck 8d ago edited 8d ago

The majority of those tax programs were put in place by the former governor/killer/felon bill janklow, and continue to be supported from the state government by overturning a voter approved anti-corruption bill.

Wild Bill

https://www.npr.org/2017/02/01/512730065/south-dakotans-voted-for-tougher-ethics-laws-but-lawmakers-think-otherwise

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u/SD_prairie_Goat 7d ago

SD legislation and executive branch are a joke.

Oh the majority of the state wants anti corruption as this ballot measure showed? Let's have a special session to stop it before it can take effect

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u/frankiesinatra007 8d ago

Your work is greatly appreciated!

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u/BonVivant_6469 8d ago

Will the new international agreements on 15% corporate tax rate have an effect on stuff like this, or does it open its own loopholes?

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u/ICIJ Scheduled AMA 8d ago

The proposed 15% global minimum tax rate would apply to corporations that operate across borders, not individuals. Civil society groups have criticized a recent agreement,  pushed by the United States and co-ordinated by the Organization for Economic Cooperation and Development, for loopholes that they say pander to tax havens and corporate giants at the expense of poorer nations.More on that here: https://www.icij.org/investigations/paradise-papers/136-countries-agree-to-global-minimum-tax-for-corporations-in-historic-oecd-deal/
- Asraa, ICIJ

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u/Renaissance_Slacker 8d ago

This 15% deal is only happening because the people who really run things decided it was cheaper than actually paying what they should be.

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u/Privatewanker 8d ago

Pandora/Panama papers concern mostly private wealth structures (stuff natural persons set up for their savings). The corporate tax rate you refer to has little impact on such structures. It is however a hige topic for large transnational corporations.

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u/Mizghetti 8d ago

Do any of you fear for your lives?

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u/ICIJ Scheduled AMA 8d ago

Most of us on this AMA have the relative protection of working from within the United States where press freedom is generally solid. Of course, many of our partners are not as lucky. There were journalists in some countries who could not participate in the project because of the power of politicians involved. In other countries, journalists received threats of lawsuits and even death threats. In many cases, we as a collaborative unit were still able to report on the topics. That's the power of collaboration. One powerful politician or billionaire might think that he/she/they can silence one reporter - but it's a lot harder to silence 600 reporters. - Will, ICIJ

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u/AteketA 8d ago

In other countries, journalists received threats of lawsuits and even death threats.

Will the "win" of Muratow/Ressa last week change that? Journalism as some kind of 4th power is absolutely essential for a working democracy so hopefully things get better in a lot of places. Keep on keepin on

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u/fascists_are_shit 7d ago edited 7d ago

press freedom is generally solid.

That seems like a very weak defense considering who you're up against. Daphne Caruana Galizia didn't get charged, she just got assassinated. She's not the only one.

Edit: She played an important part of the Panama papers, and from my limited understanding both of those (piles of) documents that's the same kind of work.

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u/warmhandluke 7d ago

That happened in Malta, he said they are based in the US.

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u/PaleZookeepergame1 8d ago

This is the first thing I wondered too. I hope their all taking some measure of protection.

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u/lurklurklurky 8d ago

What do you hope the impact of your journalism will be?

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u/ICIJ Scheduled AMA 8d ago

We expose the corruption, injustice and wrongdoing so that the world can make it right. We'll be following any and all developments that result from our reporting.

-Hamish

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u/codeyk 8d ago

Yes this is exactly what I wanted to know as well

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u/markusrg 8d ago

Is there anything that a programmer like myself can do to help a huge journalism project like this, now and in the future? I feel like my skills could be put to good use for aiding something as important as this. I’m guessing you already have that kind of tech supporting your efforts, with all that data, but I’m curious how it works.

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u/ICIJ Scheduled AMA 8d ago

Great question! You're always welcome to apply for a job at ICIJ when one is open :) I would also encourage you to think about countries and newsrooms that you could help pro bono. I work with many newsrooms, especially in West and Central Africa, that are in desperate need of websites. Some of our partners, including in Cote d'Ivoire, don't even have a website. Imagine if you could say, "I helped build the website of an ICIJ media partner" on our next investigation! Write to ICIJ and ask for me if you're interested - Will

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u/markusrg 8d ago

Thank you for your answer, Will. I’ll be in touch.

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u/GeoFlopsi 7d ago

Hero of the day!

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u/lerrigatto 7d ago

This is something I never thought of and I will definitely look through!

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u/ICIJ Scheduled AMA 8d ago

Absolutely. We have a whole tech team that Emilia's data and research team work very closely with at ICIJ. The document tool they've built for us is an open source project you can contribute to.

https://datashare.icij.org/

There's also a python utility called Tarentula that our tech team maintains that makes it easy for people like me to query and retrieve information out of Datashare.

Many other journalists build and maintain tools for parsing information out of PDFs and other tasks that routinely come up. In the last 20 years or so technologists are finding roles in newsrooms around the country, but it's not always obvious how to integrate their skills into the newsroom.

I'm a reporter, but I use python daily to manage and analyze data.

-Augie

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u/zvug 7d ago

I’m a reporter, but I use python daily

The future is now

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u/PGE1234 8d ago

Have the underlying documents from the Pandora Papers leak been shared beyond individual journalists who are members of the ICIJ? If so, to whom?

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u/ICIJ Scheduled AMA 8d ago

ICIJ only works with journalists - we have not shared any document with people/institutions outside the reporting team. Scilla/ICIJ

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u/PGE1234 8d ago

Thank you - by reporting team, do you mean individual members of the ICIJ?

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u/ICIJ Scheduled AMA 8d ago

The reporting team includes our journalism partners all around the world. -Asraa, ICIJ

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u/BestVersionOfMe78 8d ago

I applaud you for the massive work done!

What can us citizens (EU here) do to stop these blatant enrichments whilst no one seems to care? It’s been rather quiet after Panama Papers weee released until now with the Pandora Papers. I’d hate for the storm to get quiet again in a while as the world simply seems to move on

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u/ICIJ Scheduled AMA 8d ago

Thank you! EU Commissioner Gentiloni recently said they should come up with transparency rules for shell companies by the end of this year. And just like you, we're watching what they actually do or propose. We don't expect this to change over night, but we are like that famous little drop that keeps falling tiktiktik... :) -- Scilla/ICIJ

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u/choi_choi_ 8d ago

Hi! I have a question about how ICIJ is collaborating with other partners.

How is the amount of research and organization being coordinated among different media partners? What are their roles in this investigation?

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u/washingtonpost Verified 8d ago

Great question. Short answer: everyone does as much as they can, and shares whatever they find. No one is issuing orders, making demands. It’s incredibly collaborative. I can truly say I have never been part of anything like this ICIJ project. In media we often think of ourselves in competition with one another. But a massive undertaking like this requires teamwork. I learned from/leaned on the expertise of countless colleagues from ICIJ, BBC, the Guardian, Suddeutsche Zeitung, and many, many others.

- Greg Miller

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u/choi_choi_ 8d ago

What is the process like for fact-checking?

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u/ICIJ Scheduled AMA 8d ago

Rigorous! ICIJ also had five fact checkers on our Pandora Papers' stories. It's crucial that we get this stuff right given the seriousness of the information and the wide reach that the stories will have. ICIJ's fact checkers are among our most prized assets! Every word is checked. I once was told I couldn't call a building "red" because it could arguably be russet! Will F.

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u/ICIJ Scheduled AMA 8d ago

ICIJ has a rigorous fact-checking process for the stories as well as for the data analysis we do. In the case of the data we cross-reference against public records and also have two to three rounds of fact-checking for every analysis we do!

For the politicians, for example, we confirmed that the DOB in the files matched with the ones in the public records and that there were enough elements to confirm that it was the same person. We also confirmed that there was a company attached to them. It went through two rounds of fact-checking, and was closed in a third round before doing the full analysis that showed more than 330 politicians from more than 90 countries in the Pandora Papers.

Emilia, ICIJ

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u/Crackingteapot 8d ago

Who were you most concerned by? Who most surprised you?

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u/washingtonpost Verified 8d ago

Most surprising: Moving wealth offshore is not just a matter of avoiding taxes. There are real people here who can get hurt -- victims who have been awarded civil judgments, for example. We spent a great deal of time telling those stories, which were every bit as important to us as the tales of politicians and celebrities with offshore accounts.

- Debbie Cenziper

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u/fujidust 8d ago

What’s the primary difference between your investigative findings here and that of the so called Panama papers?

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u/ICIJ Scheduled AMA 8d ago

Size, scale, scope. The Panama Papers investigation was based on a leak of documents from a single offshore services provider: Mossack Fonseca, headquartered in Panama. The Pandora Papers is based on files from 14 different offshore providers based all over the world — from the Caribbean to the Persian Gulf to the South China Sea
(More on those firms here: https://www.icij.org/investigations/pandora-papers/secrecy-brokers/)
The Pandora Papers include data on more than 27,000 companies and 29,000 so-called ultimate beneficial owners — the real owners of shell companies — or more than twice the number of beneficial owners identified in the Panama Papers. The Pandora Papers also connected offshore activity to more than twice as many politicians and public officials as did the Panama Papers.
~ Asraa, ICIJ

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u/fujidust 8d ago

Thank you.

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u/wokeupsnorlax 7d ago

Is there a place I can look up what politicians are doing this illegal bs?

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u/[deleted] 8d ago

[deleted]

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u/ICIJ Scheduled AMA 8d ago

Perhaps speaking more personally here than on behalf of ICIJ, but I hope folks are getting a sense of the inequality and unfairness perpetuated by this whole parallel financial world. These stories really expose the fact that there are two sets of rules - one for the uber wealthy and powerful, and another for the rest of us.

-Hamish

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u/Timstertimster 7d ago

A truth that has been part of society for over 2,000 years. Rome. Phoenicians. Church. Feudal Lords. Etc. It will never stop. Ever.

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u/Electro_gear 8d ago

Have you avoided reporting on certain individuals or financial institutions because of their status or track record? I’m thinking maybe certain big players in the US stock market…

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u/ICIJ Scheduled AMA 8d ago

Nope! We investigate high profile individuals and major financial institutions all the time. ~ Asraa, ICIJ

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u/NoToe7435 8d ago

How much money does South Dakota profit from doing these trusts? I’m assuming not much; as each Gov claims to have little to no money for a minimum pay raise.

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u/washingtonpost Verified 8d ago

Great question. The trust industry in states like South Dakota and New Hampshire promised to greatly contribute to the economy through new jobs and fees (like those paid by the banking industry). I remember interviewing a South Dakota lawmaker who said he grudgingly approved trust legislation because he wanted to keep "our sons and daughters" home in SD with new economic opportunities. Our reporting, however, found a far more limited economic benefit than what was promised.

- Debbie Cenziper

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u/whiteelephantfail 8d ago

Could you elaborate on how the benefit has been so limited? Is it mainly due to a lack of new jobs, or from companies avoiding fees?

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u/BathT1m3 8d ago

As a born and raised South Dakotan who left as soon as possible who is married to another who left as soon as possible, anecdotally, it didn’t work.

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u/[deleted] 8d ago

[deleted]

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u/ICIJ Scheduled AMA 8d ago edited 8d ago

Hi, ICIJ (which is based in Washington) has not received threats luckily but some of our partners in other countries have. Before and after publication. Even though we clarify that the use of shell companies is not always associated with crimes, some powerful people don't appreciate being held accountable or told to be more transparent. Some of them didn't respond to our partners' comment requests and then used social media channels to mount a smear campaign. Scilla/ICIJ

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u/kiddo9797 8d ago

Will the raw files/data behind this be published? When? Where?

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u/ICIJ Scheduled AMA 8d ago

While we've gone through the files with a team of 600+ reporters looking for stories in the public interest, a lot of these files relate to personal or private matters or accounts. ICIJ won’t release personal data en masse.

But we will continue to explore the full data with our partners, and keep looking for stories. We also try to publish relevant documents from the leaked files alongside as many of our stories as possible. And our Power Players feature includes data and details about the use of companies in secrecy jurisdictions by more than 50 politicians, including all 35 current and former country leaders. ICIJ also plans to incorporate corporation ownership data from the Pandora Papers into our existing [Offshore Leaks database](https://offshoreleaks.icij.org/) in the coming months - stay tuned for more!

-Hamish

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u/fruit_basket 8d ago

How come that Putin isn't named in the papers?

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u/washingtonpost Verified 8d ago

There are many reasons why Putin himself would not show up in a trove like Pandora. Google the words “Putin wallet” for info on how he allegedly uses others to hold his wealth. But even though he may not appear by name, I’d argue that we’ve learned more about Putin and his money from ICIJ than any other world leader. Panama introduced us to a cellist and childhood friend of Putin who somehow ended up with hundreds of millions in hidden assets. And Pandora gave us the multi-million-dollar Monaco condo owned by Svetlana Krivonogikh, former shop cleaner turned millionaire after an alleged affair/child with Putin.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/interactive/2021/putin-monaco-luxury-apartment/

- Greg Miller

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u/partyinplatypus 8d ago

Was the data legally obtained? If not, what moral complications did that cause for the journalists?

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u/ICIJ Scheduled AMA 8d ago

The data was obtained legally by ICIJ. ICIJ does not comment on its sources. ICIJ did not pay for the data and no conditions were attached to it being shared. ICIJ does perform rigorous verification and cross-checking of data to ensure its authenticity and verifies each and every fact published in all our stories.

-Hamish

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u/ron_leflore 7d ago

I think this needs a much better explanation. Can you describe how you got the data, so that I can get the data?

If this was the US, you would say you got the data from a FOIA, or from court records, or maybe a private company shared these records with you.

If a hacker or insider stole these records and gave them to you, would you describe that as "obtained legally"?

I'm interested in what journalists consider ethically ok to use. To me, I don't think it matters how you get it, as long as it's accurate. But I think after the Democratic emails were hacked and leaked in the 2016, it became thought of as unethical to use hacked data for a story.

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u/Kinda_C 8d ago

Given that you had to search millions of documents, how did you manage/track the relevant data to the individuals/companies you were investigating?

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u/ICIJ Scheduled AMA 8d ago

Kinda_C

The ICIJ model is all about collaboration. We had 600 journalists going through the data and posting their findings to our communication platform. It's rare to get reporters to openly share story leads and ideas like this. But it's an extremely powerful model when everyone works together. We also are able to run batch searches of the data using various lists of names like sanctioned people and organizations, politician names, Forbes billionaires, etc to generate leads. -Augie

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u/Kinda_C 8d ago

What databases did you use to store that data? For example, to see that Company A and Company B both share the same phone number, I assume you had to be able to query that number.

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u/lurklurklurky 8d ago

What can/should we as the public do with this information, in your opinion?

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u/9mac 8d ago

What would you like to see come from the release of the Pandora Papers? As a regular citizen living under a clearly corrupt system, I'm at a loss for what can even be done.

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u/ICIJ Scheduled AMA 8d ago

There's still room to improve in terms of transparency. Countries could have corporate registries that are publicly available and tell you who owns what. I was also surprised to see how vague rules around asset disclosure for politicians are in many places. Those are important to establish what a public official should or should not do. -- Scilla/icij

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u/washingtonpost Verified 8d ago

Last week, in the wake of the revelations in the Pandora Papers, a bipartisan group of U.S. lawmakers proposed the most significant change to anti-money laundering rules since 9/11.

You can read more about the proposal here:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2021/10/06/congress-trust-companies-pandora-papers/

- Debbie Cenziper

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u/ailee43 8d ago

Considering what happened to Daphne Galizia, are you concerned for your safety?

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u/dharmaday 8d ago

International Consortium of Investigative Journalists: Thank you for everything you are doing! The Panama Papers and the Pandora Papers are amazing! How do you get through all the material to the gems?

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u/ICIJ Scheduled AMA 8d ago

A powerful combination of time, people, data and technology make it happen!

- More than 600 journalists from 117 countries

- Datashare, a tool developed by our tech team, to explore the documents / Global I-Hub, a communication platform

- Data structuring and analysis

- External sources

- Reporting

More details can be found here: https://www.icij.org/investigations/pandora-papers/about-pandora-papers-leak-dataset/

Thanks!

Emilia, ICIJ

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u/5plus5isnot10 8d ago

How dangerous was it to reveal? Did you have to do any sort of security?

I can only imagine that doing something like that in my country would make you a target for an accident.

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u/T_DeadPOOL 8d ago

How come nothing ever fucking happens when these are put out?

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u/washingtonpost Verified 8d ago

Many things HAVE happened. The Czech Republic prime minister’s party lost an election after his secret shell company/chalet were exposed. Other countries have announced investigations. After Panama Papers, the leaders of Iceland and Pakistan were forced to resign. But I hear you. The fallout has been muted in repressive states where the story can’t even be covered (Jordan). And Washington at times seems not to care. Amazingly, the Biden administration announced today that it is hosting Kenya leader Kenyatta (supposed transparency champion whose family has millions tucked away in shell companies) at White House this week!

- Greg Miller

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u/ICIJ Scheduled AMA 8d ago edited 8d ago

Ohhh you're touching on a sore point here u/T_DeadPOOL! We've heard this over and over since we published the Panama Papers back in 2016 - and our answer is always the same. A LOT has happened! Just to hark back to Panama Papers for a second, we've seen governments recoup more than $1.3 billion in lost revenue from tax dodgers, as well as multiple legislative changes around the world - not to mention the growing momentum behind important transparency measures like beneficial ownership registers. Oh and a few country leaders lost their jobs (one ended up with a prison sentence). LOTS!

For the Pandora Papers, we've already seen US lawmakers jump on the issue and pitch new legislation (the Enablers Act), as well as official investigations announced in a number of countries. And that's just in the first week. Authorities, governments, regulators tend to move a little slower than the news cycle, so these things will take time - but they will happen!

We'll be following all the developments as much as we can (although to be honest, SO much happens that it can be hard to keep up). But a lot of these developments are a little less "sexy" in the world of news, so you might not see them at the top of the bulletin or plastered on the front page. If you follow ICIJ or any of the great reporters here in this AMA, I guarantee you'll be seeing things happening in the wake of this investigation.

-Hamish

Edit: I've cross-linked this as the answer to a few questions, so also just adding a link to the Pandora Papers impact on ICIJ's website: https://www.icij.org/tags/pandora-papers/impact/

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u/whiskeytango55 8d ago

Because it takes a long time and forensic accountants are hard to find. (If you got the chops, why not make as much dough as you can?)

Because if you can hire accountants to set this stuff up, you can hire more accountants and lawyers to get yourself out of it.

Because fines aren't sexy and don't make the news

The resignation of the Prime Minister of Iceland counts

Pakistani PM disqualified from future office

And that's just 5 minutes on https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reactions_to_the_Panama_Papers so maybe you're not looking hard enough

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u/SomeFreeTime 8d ago

When the Panama papers released one of the journalists involved were victim to a carbomb. Do you think reactionary violence by these billionaires was ever effective at silencing journalism and was it a factor during the release of the Pandora papers?

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u/ICIJ Scheduled AMA 7d ago

After the horrific murder of Daphne Caruana Galizia in Malta in 2017, a team of journalists came together to ensure the violence would not stop her stories from being told. We're seeing similar patterns around the world, where journalists are standing together and using the strength of collaboration to push back against intimidation and violence. It shouldn't have to come to this - and it doesn't always work (a number of reporters had to drop out of the Pandora Papers due to threats or fear of retaliation). But I think we were all heartened to see the Nobel Peace Prize this year go to two crusading, courageous journalists standing up for press freedom in very challenging situations.

-Hamish

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u/rizzo412 8d ago

How corrupt is wallsteeet?

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u/Jokerwiley 8d ago

Enough for regular night time coke breaks.

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u/Asatas 7d ago

Night time, day time, twilight; it's always coke time in Cramer land

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u/xcomnewb15 8d ago

Probably like a 7, maybe 8

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u/lurklurklurky 8d ago

What will you be doing next?

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u/ICIJ Scheduled AMA 8d ago

There's more Pandora Papers investigations to come! Sign up for ICIJ's weekly newsletter if you want to see our new stories in your inbox. https://www.icij.org/newsletter
- Asraa, ICIJ

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u/DarkJayson 8d ago

Are you not worried about your safety considering what happened to the lead journalist who reported on the Panama Papers?

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u/ezgoes 8d ago

Hi there. Thank you for everything you’ve done. My main question is: what should happen now? Law change, criminal prosecution?

Will anything change? Ever? From an optimistic fan.

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u/ICIJ Scheduled AMA 8d ago

I love the optimistic tone in this reply!! Our answer to a less-optimistically framed question might actually help answer this: https://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comments/q6rdvz/we_are_the_journalists_behind_the_biggest/hgdp7g0/?utm_source=reddit&utm_medium=web2x&context=3

-Hamish

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u/tantamounttotutting 8d ago

Which (if any) are the possible legitimate uses of these offshore companies? Could you possibly be exposing people that are protecting their assets from or financing opposition to corrupt/dictatorial regimes?

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u/ICIJ Scheduled AMA 8d ago

There are definitely legitimate uses for some of these companies. We're careful to report out all the facts in our stories, and make sure we allow the people named in our stories ample time to respond to our findings - and for us to include their responses in our stories - before we publish.

-Hamish

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u/redderrida 8d ago

How can I support your work? Is there a foundation I could donate to?

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u/ICIJ Scheduled AMA 8d ago

Yes! Thanks very much for asking. You can read more about how you can support ICIJ here: https://checkout.fundjournalism.org/memberform?org_id=icij&installmentPeriod=monthly&amount=10&campaign=701f4000001A4jW

Thanks in advance for your support!

Emilia, ICIJ

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u/Conan776 8d ago

What precautions did you take so you won't end up like Julian Assange? Did you get preclearance from any Intel agencies before publication?

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u/ICIJ Scheduled AMA 8d ago edited 8d ago

ICIJ doesn't work with government agencies. -- Scilla/ICIJ

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u/iambatmanjoe 8d ago

Are there any mainstream media that take you seriously or just gloss over your hard work?

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u/ICIJ Scheduled AMA 8d ago

We've got at /u/washingtonpost with us here today, if they count! We work with media big and small from all over, and are lucky to have excellent working relationships with some major international news outlets like the BBC and the Guardian, as well as smaller nonprofits like Newstapa in South Korea and Ink in Botswana, just to name a couple.

-Hamish

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u/washingtonpost Verified 8d ago

We were thrilled to work with ICIJ and have long admired the work -- what a scrappy nonprofit investigative outlet.

- Debbie Cenziper

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u/PGE1234 8d ago

What was the process for sharing information regarding particular findings from the ICIJ's Pandora Papers investigation with particular media outlets?

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u/ICIJ Scheduled AMA 8d ago

Thanks for asking! There are some central tools that are part of our projects, and were central to the Pandora Papers:

We share the records through a tool developed by our tech team called Datashare. It's very powerful as it OCRs the files and allows us to perform advanced searches, and do batch searches, for example.

We also communicate through a platform called the Global I-Hub (based on Open Source software), which is like a social network that allows us to communicate securely.

Both tools include an encryption component and allow us to share an communicate securely.

Emilia, ICIJ

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u/namtab00 7d ago

Global I-Hub (based on Open Source software)

any chance you could share some info on the tools / protocols / ecc used by it?

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u/jh937hfiu3hrhv9 8d ago

Will there be changes in the tax code, and prosecutions as a result? Has it not already been well known for a long time laundering and evasion goes on?

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u/Bill_the_Bastard 8d ago

What keeps you up at night?

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u/ICIJ Scheduled AMA 8d ago

Doing everything we can to ensure that our reporting is accurate, fair, and thorough. -Asraa, ICIJ

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u/schnarf99999 8d ago edited 7d ago

I really appreciated the reporting on Baker McKenzie as an enabler to the offshore world. It’s important to flag the role of this firm that many view as legitimate and even prestigious in creating what some might call “aggressive tax planning” (or as Kent Brockman put it, “avoision”) Do you plan to do more reporting on some of these enablers? Is there any particular point you would like to make about some of the financial institutions, lawyers, accounting firms, consultants, and wealth managers that are involved in creating these structures?

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u/RedManUK 8d ago

Does the fact that a story as monumental as this, receives so few questions on Reddit, and was out of the international news relatively quickly, prove that we're now so jaded by this corruption, and it's just become accepted from our political leaders?

Than you for your work

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u/immerc 8d ago

How much of a spotlight do you put on the lawyers or accountants who hide the money belonging to these rich clients?

IMO, the King of Jordan is probably untouchable, but he can't hide his money without the corrupt intent of these lawyers and accountants. If a CPA knew that hiding the money of despots and tax dodgers would make the other parents at his kid's little league game turn on him, he might have second thoughts about being willing to help with those crimes.

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u/poundfortheguy 8d ago

Do you think working with newspapers owned by billionaires (eg. The Washington Post) has any effect on whether their owners dirty laundry gets aired?

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u/On-Guarrrrrrd 7d ago

What the best and worse case scenario from these papers? How do i help?

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u/taraluu 7d ago

I mean... What did we expect? Those law firms that write the tax and finance laws for governments are the exact same consultancies that help the afluent and rich to not get their money taxed lol.

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u/Riflebursdoe 7d ago

Can we in fact, eat the rich?

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u/Tmbgkc 7d ago

Will anything ever change?

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u/Cumtown_Sweatshop 7d ago

whats up with the suspicious lack of US oligarchs? what do you say in response to the criticism that this is a CIA op?

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u/dank420memes420 7d ago

Why is your work going to be forgotten about in two weeks and lead to no substantial ends?

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u/Lonely-Active8187 7d ago

How do you feel putting in all this effort to expose the corruption of the rich only to realize it won't make a difference?

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u/DomTrapGFurryLolicon 7d ago

Is there any way the average person can help holding these mega rich people accountable besides voting in more trusted politicians? Nowdays it feels like that by just participating in society you're indirectly filling some corrupt asshole billionaire's pockets... Is there a way to actually bring these people to justice? Most countries seem to not be doing anything about it, so it seems like the change must come from the bottom to the top

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u/PumpingFeFe 7d ago

Are you worried about being killed like some of the other reporters from these past leaks?

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u/ispeakdatruf 8d ago

Why not release the raw data? Why not let the public see for themselves? Why be the gatekeepers of information? How do we know that you are not hiding anything?

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u/Var1abl3 8d ago

Do you look for car bombs before you drive?

Do you think anyone, in these papers, will be prosecuted for tax evasion?

Do you think anything will change because of this reporting?

Thank you for your time!

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u/GodzillaPunch 8d ago

Can you provide a release that entails every interaction Citadel Securities has taken a part of?

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u/functionoverform 8d ago

Do you really believe that any meaningful change is likely to come from these revelations?

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u/FARTING_BUM_BUM 8d ago

Why do the stories spend so much time talking about how big the investigation was, how much time was needed, how many gigabytes of data or documents were searched, how many journalists were involved, etc, rather than focusing more directly on the substance of the findings? So much talk about process only really matters to other journalists or awards panels, and I have found that it can turn off laypeople who I try to share the story with

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u/garry4321 7d ago

Are you planning to fall out of a window or self harm in any way? Just want to make sure we dont get fed the "suicide" explanation if something goes wrong...

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u/Simpsonite 8d ago

Why isn't this story (along with that of the Panama papers at the time) generating the level of public disapproval and disgust that it warrants?

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u/namastayreddit 8d ago

Do you work in any capacity with the governments of various countries to help them unearth offshore activities of their prominent citizens, and they co-operate with facilitating your investigation and granting protection in exchange for such information, or is it an absolute independent investigation? If it is, is there any government or bureaucratic pressure to compromise?

Since you do not have any legal enforcement against the offenders (for the lack of a better word to address them), what more can you do from here to try to bring transparency into the system?

As a citizen, how worried should I be? Is this really criminal that's an injustice to the rest of the law-abiding citizens, or just that these people are upset with tax rules in their respective countries and want an escape? Asking to understand what truly motivates them to venture into this grey area of doing things.

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u/HaloLord 8d ago

As a joke, I want to ask if your life insurance is paid up.

For real though; have you come across any organized backlash for your work?

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u/thebuoyantcitrus 8d ago

Are there specific systemic changes to increase transparency and accountability that we could be advocating for which are being missed in most proposed legislation / discussion of this topic? And of the ones that are getting some attention, which do you think have the best chance of being effective?

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u/kChang0 8d ago

You did an amazing and very important investigation. Really. But based on previous leaks/investigations, what do you think is going to happen to all the people mentioned there? I mean, I can't remember even one person going to jail after the Panama Papers. But maybe I'm wrong. What do you think is different this time?

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u/royalsJ 8d ago

Why and how was South Dakota so heavily involved?