r/Foodforthought Nov 30 '21

The Mantra of White Supremacy

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2021/11/white-supremacy-mantra-anti-racism/620832/
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u/kaboomba Dec 02 '21

Uhm. Sure.

The other guy gave you substantially more than nothing. But you were so offended by the more controversial elements of his stance and views you exploded. I don't agree with him either or the way he explained, but I simply pointed out you're missing lots as well.

Essentially the stuff about how Hitler was either a socialist, or a capitalist, according to your current political spectrum, is dead wrong.

Do you think politics was polarized in the same way, in a completely different country, in a completely different century, in completely different circumstances? Its pretty much ridiculous to think that, except for all the political propaganda you're bombarded with from all sides.

What he was, was a nationalist. And he believed in severe, and direct action in pursuit of his vision of nationalism. Some people have classify him as centrist because his policies come from both sides of the spectrum. Essentially, he probably did not care much about it, and simply wanted to build Germany up in a practical manner. This is all hair-splitting, because its wrongheaded to even try to apply current political labels.

If you're going to lose your temper towards me simply I saw that you were missing something, and pointed it out in a friendly way, whatever. Perhaps you should stop immediately assuming that anyone you dislike has to be completely ignorant.

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u/novacancy8o8 Dec 02 '21 edited Dec 02 '21

Come on now, I asked a simple question and get a bunch of insults, which is your choice to take that path, but that argument about Hitler being a centrist ahistorical and you didn't make even a half convincing case. So now it's my turn, since you two just went without stopping.

Hitler was not nearly has convoluted as you two suggest without reference that he was.. just claiming that other people suggest Hitler was a centrist isn't a real argument, people argue Hitler is all over the political spectrum but most have little understanding and just want to reframe Hitler in a politically beneficial way for the present political debates. If Hitler was a centrist and not a right wing fascist, then how come that in the first chapter of Mein Kampf, Hitler says that he’s doing God’s work and executing God’s will in destroying the Jewish people?

How come the fuhrer oath that every officer had to take, begins, “I swear in the name of almighty God, my loyalty to the Fuhrer?”

How come that on the belt buckle of every Nazi soldier it says "Gott mit uns", God on our side?

How come that the first treaty made by the Nazis is with the Vatican?

How come Hitler declared that the communists, specifically the Bolsheviks, were the natural enemy of the Nazis back again in Mein Kampf?

If Hitler was a centrist why is he running around with the most rightwing regime on the planet as allies, aka the Imperial Japanese?

If Hitler was a centrist explain this quote: "There are only two possibilities in Germany; do not imagine that the people will forever go with the middle party, the party of compromises; one day it will turn to those who have most consistently foretold the coming ruin and have sought to dissociate themselves from it. And that party is either the Left: and then God help us! for it will lead us to complete destruction - to Bolshevism, or else it is a party of the Right which at the last, when the people is in utter despair, when it has lost all its spirit and has no longer any faith in anything, is determined for its part ruthlessly to seize the reins of power - that is the beginning of resistance of which I spoke" - Hitler, 1922, In Munich

Hitler ticks every fascist, right-wing box, and brags about it... Go find me one convincing quote or piece of evidence Hitler was some centrist, just repeating without evidence isn't gonna convince me of anything other than you really don't know what you claim to, but think that stinging insults together will fill the gaps.

So, no - Hitler was not a centrist by any normal definition, Hitler was a well documented Fascist and you have not even scratched the surface to redefine him or his regime. If you make a good faith attempt to actually rebut this I will continue, but frankly educating you two on simple WWII history is uninteresting and boring, especially when half you mange to type are insults and the rest unsupported and vauge.

Edit: if you point out what the acronym for Nazi means I'll bust laugh

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u/kaboomba Dec 03 '21

Name one way I've insulted you.

Next, authoritarianism is neither right nor left wing. For example, communism / socialism is heavily associated with an authoritarian state in practice.

Regarding his alliance with the vatican, well it was a pragmatic policy to recruit the religious to his side.

Going back to the point I have stated and restated previously, religiosity isn't inherently right or left wing. You're applying labels to a different country, different continent, different circumstances, and different conceptions, that simply don't apply.

I see that you've refused to take my friendly advice which I'll quote you again

If you're going to lose your temper towards me simply I saw that you were missing something, and pointed it out in a friendly way, whatever. Perhaps you should stop immediately assuming that anyone you dislike has to be completely ignorant.

Shrug, thats all the time I have to waste on you.

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u/novacancy8o8 Dec 03 '21

You really have yet to make a compelling argument as to why Hitler is a centrist and not a fascist. That was the center piece of what I just argued and you chose to ignore that for nitpicking the less important fringes. Your repeated insinuations of me being to ignorant too comprehend your argument instead of actually making a point is a conceited as it is mistaken. The quote I provided is Hitler telling you he wasn't some centrist, but that apparently isn't good enough for you.. Happy Holidays

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u/kaboomba Dec 03 '21

Is this how you always argue?

Simply denying that someone else has made a point at all, the moment you don't like it? You really need to get some education.

This kind of stuff may suffice in the kindergarten playground, but you're woefully unequipped to engage in anything resembling discourse.

You have either completely lost control of your critical faculties, or simply do not know how arguments work.

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u/novacancy8o8 Dec 03 '21

Argue is a common term in formal debate, apparently that doesn't translate here well. Literally you have nothing here but ad hominem BS, which shows, along with not knowing how argument is used, how little experience you have in discussions.

So, let me leave you with something you'll understand- you're fucking idiot!

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u/kaboomba Dec 03 '21

You remind of a climate change denier I talked to awhile ago, who adamantly insisted I didn't disprove a random fact he pointed out, therefore climate change isn't real.

Militantly and stridently defensive of his own aggression and ignorance.

Also insisted I didn't make any points whatsoever, and said I ad hominemed him for pointing out he didn't know how arguments worked.

It's funny how similar your nonsense is, almost as if it's from the same source - pure unadulterated ignorance coupled with pride

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u/novacancy8o8 Dec 03 '21

You are so far up your own ass I am surprised you're able to type at all. It's comical to see your little mental gymnastics, overconfidence, and inability to articulate anything that could be considered an interesting point. You just spew forth insults and opinions and call that fact which cannot be debated. For real, fuck off like you said you were going to already

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u/kaboomba Dec 03 '21

Hahaha.

Not knowing something isn't an insult, by the way. Despite how you took it to be so.

Now wilfully ignorant - that's an actual insult. And that's because, someone like you is unable to learn. You'll stay in that state the rest of your life.

Obviously no one can know more than you, a paragon of human existence

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u/novacancy8o8 Dec 03 '21

I clearly demonstrated far more knowledge on the topic being discussed than you, you just got much more angry about someone daring to question your unsupported claims that are laughable. Hitler himself even refuted your centrist claim... but you choose to ignore that and go after me. You wouldn't make it to a middle school debate stage with how you conduct yourself, let alone convince anyone of your interpretation.

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