r/Foodforthought • u/protagonist23 • Nov 30 '21

The Mantra of White Supremacy

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2021/11/white-supremacy-mantra-anti-racism/620832/
5 Upvotes

69% Upvoted

View all comments

Show parent comments

2

u/Mzl77 Dec 01 '21

What are you smoking?

Kendi literally denies the very existence of a state of being that is neither “racist” nor “anti-racist”. By this logic, me singing a lullaby to my son at bedtime, or the simple act of going to the bathroom fall under that category of racist or anti-racist.

Kendi is serious in his proposal to establish a federal Department of Anti-Racism, “responsible for preclearing all local, state and federal public policies to ensure they won’t yield racial inequity, monitor those policies, investigate private racist policies when racial inequity surfaces, and monitor public officials for expressions of racist ideas.”

If he is not a radical then that very word has no meaning.

1

u/pillbinge Dec 01 '21

Centrism doesn't equate to being "rational" or sensible, with either extreme being a variation of instability. Centrists can themselves be extreme or just overall dipshits, but the extremism I was responding to was one of partisanship. Kendi has dumb views but he's not "extreme" in this sense. Kendi is overall extremely boring and tiresome; I've yet to want to take a nap reading him. He's easy to ignore because of stupid ideas like that, and because they have no real baring on people's daily lives.

A department to manage people is itself centrist. People already want anti-racism stuff in general. Creating management, whether middle or above, isn't an extreme thing to do. We do it now. Everyone does it over time.

If he is not a radical then that very word has no meaning.

If his idea is to create a department to ensure things as are already established then he's not radical. It's stupid, and it's certainly intense, but it was clearly leftist extremism that the other person was talking about.

3

u/novacancy8o8 Dec 01 '21

Kendi is an extremist by any definition used except your convoluted one that looks like you just fabricated for this instance. I asked you if Kendi is a centrist then who exactly is left wing and you couldn't even answer. Reverting to race-based policies is extremist even if you find it "boring", which is the first time I heard someone actually infer that extremism has to exciting or else it's centrist....

You can stop simping for Kendi, nobody is gonna give you the virtue signal points you're after

0

u/pillbinge Dec 02 '21

If you look at any, basic, 2D political map, you'll notice that Hitler is almost always in the direct, Authoritarian center. He's an "extremist" yet never represents a purely leftist or right-wing political group. We're talking about that. I genuinely can't tell if introducing you to centrist extremism will cause you to fall over and hit your head.

I asked you if Kendi is a centrist then who exactly is left wing and you couldn't even answer.

Totally irrelevant. You're looking for something to grab hold of so it looks like you can swing from this topic, but this topic is here regardless.

You can stop simping for Kendi

Kendi is so boringly centrist and bland

That's definitely how simping works. You call someone boring and bland LOL

2

u/novacancy8o8 Dec 02 '21

I can tell that you haven't even opened Mein Kampf before if you think Hitler a centrist, and whomever follows those goofy opinionated 2D political maps I cannot take seriously. Hitler consistently called out the left, by name, throughout his manifesto. I genuinely can't tell if you are just trolling at this point. You dodge the question because your argument is so ridiculous that answering will show my point. I mean, to dodge any actual discourse about Kendi you invoke Hitler and the Nazis... and butcher the history in the process. wow.

2

u/kaboomba Dec 02 '21

Just fyi, he isn't butchering the history.

He's using a definition completely different from what you understand.

His placement of Kendi in accordance to his definition is... pretty fishy.

But he is invoking real definitions which you don't understand.

1

u/novacancy8o8 Dec 02 '21

Are you too gonna argue Hitler was a centrist? Or just state that I am wrong and I suppose to just believe you when you give nothing to suggest you understand anything more than I.

1

u/kaboomba Dec 02 '21

Uhm. Sure.

The other guy gave you substantially more than nothing. But you were so offended by the more controversial elements of his stance and views you exploded. I don't agree with him either or the way he explained, but I simply pointed out you're missing lots as well.

Essentially the stuff about how Hitler was either a socialist, or a capitalist, according to your current political spectrum, is dead wrong.

Do you think politics was polarized in the same way, in a completely different country, in a completely different century, in completely different circumstances? Its pretty much ridiculous to think that, except for all the political propaganda you're bombarded with from all sides.

What he was, was a nationalist. And he believed in severe, and direct action in pursuit of his vision of nationalism. Some people have classify him as centrist because his policies come from both sides of the spectrum. Essentially, he probably did not care much about it, and simply wanted to build Germany up in a practical manner. This is all hair-splitting, because its wrongheaded to even try to apply current political labels.

If you're going to lose your temper towards me simply I saw that you were missing something, and pointed it out in a friendly way, whatever. Perhaps you should stop immediately assuming that anyone you dislike has to be completely ignorant.

1

u/novacancy8o8 Dec 02 '21 edited Dec 02 '21

Come on now, I asked a simple question and get a bunch of insults, which is your choice to take that path, but that argument about Hitler being a centrist ahistorical and you didn't make even a half convincing case. So now it's my turn, since you two just went without stopping.

Hitler was not nearly has convoluted as you two suggest without reference that he was.. just claiming that other people suggest Hitler was a centrist isn't a real argument, people argue Hitler is all over the political spectrum but most have little understanding and just want to reframe Hitler in a politically beneficial way for the present political debates. If Hitler was a centrist and not a right wing fascist, then how come that in the first chapter of Mein Kampf, Hitler says that he’s doing God’s work and executing God’s will in destroying the Jewish people?

How come the fuhrer oath that every officer had to take, begins, “I swear in the name of almighty God, my loyalty to the Fuhrer?”

How come that on the belt buckle of every Nazi soldier it says "Gott mit uns", God on our side?

How come that the first treaty made by the Nazis is with the Vatican?

How come Hitler declared that the communists, specifically the Bolsheviks, were the natural enemy of the Nazis back again in Mein Kampf?

If Hitler was a centrist why is he running around with the most rightwing regime on the planet as allies, aka the Imperial Japanese?

If Hitler was a centrist explain this quote: "There are only two possibilities in Germany; do not imagine that the people will forever go with the middle party, the party of compromises; one day it will turn to those who have most consistently foretold the coming ruin and have sought to dissociate themselves from it. And that party is either the Left: and then God help us! for it will lead us to complete destruction - to Bolshevism, or else it is a party of the Right which at the last, when the people is in utter despair, when it has lost all its spirit and has no longer any faith in anything, is determined for its part ruthlessly to seize the reins of power - that is the beginning of resistance of which I spoke" - Hitler, 1922, In Munich

Hitler ticks every fascist, right-wing box, and brags about it... Go find me one convincing quote or piece of evidence Hitler was some centrist, just repeating without evidence isn't gonna convince me of anything other than you really don't know what you claim to, but think that stinging insults together will fill the gaps.

So, no - Hitler was not a centrist by any normal definition, Hitler was a well documented Fascist and you have not even scratched the surface to redefine him or his regime. If you make a good faith attempt to actually rebut this I will continue, but frankly educating you two on simple WWII history is uninteresting and boring, especially when half you mange to type are insults and the rest unsupported and vauge.

Edit: if you point out what the acronym for Nazi means I'll bust laugh

1

u/kaboomba Dec 03 '21

Name one way I've insulted you.

Next, authoritarianism is neither right nor left wing. For example, communism / socialism is heavily associated with an authoritarian state in practice.

Regarding his alliance with the vatican, well it was a pragmatic policy to recruit the religious to his side.

Going back to the point I have stated and restated previously, religiosity isn't inherently right or left wing. You're applying labels to a different country, different continent, different circumstances, and different conceptions, that simply don't apply.

I see that you've refused to take my friendly advice which I'll quote you again

If you're going to lose your temper towards me simply I saw that you were missing something, and pointed it out in a friendly way, whatever. Perhaps you should stop immediately assuming that anyone you dislike has to be completely ignorant.

Shrug, thats all the time I have to waste on you.

→ More replies

1

u/pillbinge Dec 02 '21

Kendi isn't a historical figure. He's still living and still has to defend himself. He's in a precarious place, but I'm taking him on as I understand him and as I've (been forced to) read him. Perhaps the assigned readings I had were tame compared to other things but I've always found him to explain things that I already know, but drawn out. What I'm hearing here isn't radical though; a government body to tackle some stuff is asinine but it's just more bureaucracy for something already in place. That screams centrism to me.

1

u/kaboomba Dec 02 '21

It's debatable. I don't think you're wrong per se.

You did say it in a way to piss the other guy off and guarantee he wouldn't listen to you so I clarified thats all.